|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Sunflower
Valinor
Aug 5 2012, 4:56am
Views: 785
Shortcut
|
LOL! I've just been "out-conspiracy-theoried". I take my hat off to you, sir! And FANTASTIC article above...Film 2 plays out here pretty much as I thought it would, right down to the Rohan/Lake-town, Theoden/Master, Eomer/Bard, and Helm's Deep/Endof Smaug scenarios..plus the title there's an operatic quality to the thing, that Lucas rarely achived in his Prequels (Tatooine scenes in 2 being a rare succes in this regard.) In addition: let me speculate on the title The Desolation of Smaug. Some people don't like that title, thinking it too Lucas-y. I think it is not only BRILLAINT but the only possibe title. How? Well, "desolation" can mean any number of things, depending on the context it is used in. It has so many layers. --First what everyone immediately thinks of when they hear the title: on the Map: the "Desolation of Smaug" being the actual physical evidence of his destructive passing: the ruins of Dale, the scorched earth, ie the actual Destruction Zone, whic we will glimpses of in flashback and as the Company walks past it. --The "desolation" also can refer to the KIND of world Smaug left behind: where hope no longer exists, ie hope for the future. In all the lands that he has touched, the great Worm has left woe in the hearts of all: Men, Dwarves..and in their wariness, even in the hearts of Thranduils' folk in Mirkwood. This part of M-e as passed from "innocence" to frightful Experience. In that terrible knowledge, there is the Desolation of newfound maturity. --"Deslolation" can then be a spiritual state, affecting and exhibited by all the peoples that Smaug has touched. The greed of the Dwarves for their lost treasure (and what this does later to Thorin and the rest, but esp Thorins character); the corruption of the Master and Laketown's inner circle; a despair initially exhibited by the people of Dale akin to what we see first in Edoras...no "more cheer than a graveyard." I expect a similarmood among its people to previal when the company enters the city. --finally..(and this is getting existential here I admit): how might Smuag himself be "desolate"? He appear to be on top of the world, but I'm sure Tolkien would have us beleive that he was a happier creature before he got bogged down by his "sickness". Having responsibilty for, and having to pretect, such a Hoard carries a personal price, no? If lust for the Jewels borught the Noldor down, then even such as Smuag can be brought from bad to infinetely worse, by his greed. So "desolation of Smaug" exists on so many levels, and this desolation permeates Film 2 like a sponge.
(This post was edited by Sunflower on Aug 5 2012, 4:57am)
|
|
|
Subject
|
User
|
Time
|
Greenbooks guest post: in defense of a Hobbit trilogy
|
News from Bree
|
Aug 3 2012, 9:33pm
|
Excellent write-up...
|
Maiarmike
|
Aug 4 2012, 4:29am
|
Seems perfect
|
JayFank
|
Aug 4 2012, 4:06pm
|
EXCELLENT
|
Buchanicus
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:32am
|
Excellent Article!
|
Istaris'staffs
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:58am
|
The is great!
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 8:21am
|
Wow!
|
TheBeerBaron
|
Aug 4 2012, 9:03am
|
Jackson should hire this guy
|
guitarzankansasfan
|
Aug 4 2012, 9:48am
|
Where can I find more
|
TheBeerBaron
|
Aug 4 2012, 10:27am
|
Congratulations! This is by far the best post/article I've ever read on TORn
|
kiwifan
|
Aug 4 2012, 11:23am
|
I have to disagree...
|
Spaldron
|
Aug 4 2012, 12:53pm
|
But LOTR movie Bilbo has no connection with dwarves at all.
|
Plurmo
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:21am
|
This is amazing.
|
DesiringDragons
|
Aug 4 2012, 1:04pm
|
If they include the events of the War in the North -
|
Hanzkaz
|
Aug 4 2012, 1:06pm
|
No ... just no ... ;-)
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 1:09pm
|
I agree that there is enough for 4 movies.
|
Escapist
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:08pm
|
Sorry - this article was so exciting
|
Escapist
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:13pm
|
I do believe that Warner Brothers only has the rights to make three movies.
|
Kangi Ska
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:29pm
|
Not so
|
Voronwë_the_Faithful
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:50pm
|
Thanks VF
|
Kangi Ska
|
Aug 4 2012, 3:09pm
|
He said that about The Hobbit
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 3:11pm
|
I would be shocked if Jackson directed any further Middle-earth films after this
|
Voronwë_the_Faithful
|
Aug 4 2012, 3:12pm
|
I can't imagine more films after this either.
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 3:22pm
|
I wonder what other work of Tolkien's could successfully be adapted to film...?
|
Captain Salt
|
Aug 4 2012, 4:18pm
|
Going by the Appendices -
|
Hanzkaz
|
Aug 4 2012, 4:51pm
|
Would love to see a story dealing with the explored regions of ME...
|
Captain Salt
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:11pm
|
I'd prefer a brief reference to the war in the north be included in the existing films than that a stand-alone film be made
|
Bladerunner
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:23pm
|
Wasn't me (assuming you mean me, and not another Daniel).
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:45pm
|
Certain Amount Of Tme
|
JWPlatt
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:10pm
|
Answer and perhaps another conspiracy theory
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:30pm
|
Ack! That's twice today I've spelled "rationale" as "rational"
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:47pm
|
A good question
|
Voronwë_the_Faithful
|
Aug 4 2012, 6:02pm
|
LOL.
|
Silverlode
|
Aug 4 2012, 6:06pm
|
Doesn't it strictly forbid the use of the character Glorfindel
|
Kangi Ska
|
Aug 4 2012, 6:43pm
|
LOL II
|
JWPlatt
|
Aug 4 2012, 6:56pm
|
At your own risk
|
Voronwë_the_Faithful
|
Aug 4 2012, 6:59pm
|
Desolation of Smaug
|
Sunflower
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:56am
|
Bravo! I'm sold! Let me count the ways.
|
Ruxendil_Thoorg
|
Aug 4 2012, 1:47pm
|
I hope it convinces others as well
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:04pm
|
Um.... What?
|
GoodGuyA
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:03pm
|
See this thread
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:09pm
|
I still doubt it's Gimli. Love his voice though!
|
GoodGuyA
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:11pm
|
Whether it is a physical role or just a voice cameo
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:12pm
|
As a matter of preference,
|
Escapist
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:20pm
|
Brilliant speculation! I hope the actual films are close to this as it
|
Eruonen
|
Aug 4 2012, 2:57pm
|
Well done
|
Black Breathalizer
|
Aug 4 2012, 3:20pm
|
In all of this I hope that "The Hobbit" does not get lost.
|
Kangi Ska
|
Aug 4 2012, 3:45pm
|
It could, or it could enhance both trilogies into one continuous story.
|
Silverlode
|
Aug 4 2012, 7:09pm
|
Agree completely with this Silverlode
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 7:22pm
|
Looking at it...
|
Silverlode
|
Aug 4 2012, 7:41pm
|
I thought it might be interesting -
|
Hanzkaz
|
Aug 4 2012, 7:26pm
|
This is brilliant speculation
|
Shelob'sAppetite
|
Aug 4 2012, 7:47pm
|
The "quiet bits"
|
Silverlode
|
Aug 4 2012, 8:26pm
|
Again well-written article, however
|
Captain Salt
|
Aug 4 2012, 3:50pm
|
Since it's been described as a third Hobbit film
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 4 2012, 4:14pm
|
The strength of the proposal
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 4 2012, 4:50pm
|
"Killed by pirates is good" ;)
|
DesiringDragons
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:19pm
|
That was the same point I was making in a previous post....
|
Bladerunner
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:34pm
|
Apologies for having missed that.
|
DesiringDragons
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:38pm
|
Well if film 2 is to focus on Smaug
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:42pm
|
Only if they're "man-in-suit" --
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 4 2012, 7:52pm
|
Two Disagreements....
|
Bladerunner
|
Aug 4 2012, 4:50pm
|
I don't want Sauron to be at the Battle of Five Armies
|
Hanzkaz
|
Aug 4 2012, 4:57pm
|
I'd prefer that the killings of the Azog, the Great Goblin, and Smaug would be enough motivation for teh Goblins and Wargs....
|
Bladerunner
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:13pm
|
I wouldn't be surprised if Azog and his crew -
|
Hanzkaz
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:18pm
|
Back when Benedict Cumberbatch
|
Silverlode
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:39pm
|
I like that approach also...
|
Bladerunner
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:57pm
|
A third film's impact on Film 2
|
Black Breathalizer
|
Aug 4 2012, 5:19pm
|
That third film still seems like a drag
|
HiddenSpring
|
Aug 4 2012, 8:24pm
|
Film 3 will likely include more than BOFA, IMO
|
Shelob'sAppetite
|
Aug 4 2012, 8:31pm
|
Film 3 has other key events....
|
Bladerunner
|
Aug 4 2012, 10:21pm
|
Good article
|
Yngwulff
|
Aug 4 2012, 10:25pm
|
Contents
|
Lurker in the Dark
|
Aug 5 2012, 3:06am
|
Film 2
|
Yngwulff
|
Aug 5 2012, 3:22am
|
Interesting theory about Bard and Tauriel...
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 5 2012, 3:24am
|
Isn't Bard married?
|
Yngwulff
|
Aug 5 2012, 3:30am
|
Ah yes, but no (living) wife as far as I've heard
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 5 2012, 3:35am
|
Could imply
|
Yngwulff
|
Aug 5 2012, 3:40am
|
Contents
|
Lurker in the Dark
|
Aug 5 2012, 7:20am
|
Why Gandalf chose Bilbo *SPOILER - COMIC CON FOOTAGE*
|
Kassandros
|
Aug 6 2012, 4:35pm
|
Frodo being meant to have the Ring..
|
Silverlode
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:04am
|
Unless Kili is revealed to be half-elven...
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:24am
|
*snort* Well at least...
|
Silverlode
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:33am
|
I just had a terrible thought...
|
TheBeerBaron
|
Aug 6 2012, 6:51am
|
Tauriel and Kili
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 6 2012, 7:14am
|
I thought we figured that was in jest
|
TheBeerBaron
|
Aug 6 2012, 7:19am
|
It's more real
|
DanielLB
|
Aug 6 2012, 7:32am
|
Thanks DLB
|
TheBeerBaron
|
Aug 6 2012, 7:35am
|
Highly improbable
|
Shelob'sAppetite
|
Aug 6 2012, 3:27pm
|
Prophecy and Tauriel
|
Phibbus
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:05am
|
Tauriel
|
Lurker in the Dark
|
Aug 5 2012, 7:45am
|
Gandalf picking Bilbo
|
BeornBerserker
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:29am
|
Nonsense
|
Shelob'sAppetite
|
Aug 5 2012, 5:36am
|
Tauriel and Bard
|
innoce77
|
Aug 6 2012, 8:33am
|
Welcome out of lurkerdom innoce77
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 6 2012, 5:16pm
|
Divinely inspired
|
Black Breathalizer
|
Aug 6 2012, 8:24pm
|
Amen
|
Shelob'sAppetite
|
Aug 6 2012, 11:11pm
|
yes
|
Lusitano
|
Aug 7 2012, 1:24am
|
Love. lol
|
AinurOlorin
|
Aug 7 2012, 2:56am
|
Prophecy appears in several places, most notably from Gandalf and Glorfindel, actually
|
AinurOlorin
|
Aug 6 2012, 2:20pm
|
Still not sure about that third film...
|
Phibbus
|
Aug 5 2012, 3:17am
|
Hee hee
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 5 2012, 3:32am
|
Lucasian Structure
|
JWPlatt
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:39am
|
*heh* I can't complain
|
Eowyn of Penns Woods
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:56am
|
Personal Canon
|
JWPlatt
|
Aug 5 2012, 5:11am
|
Unconscious Bilbo
|
Phibbus
|
Aug 5 2012, 5:06am
|
But is it a good idea
|
Shelob'sAppetite
|
Aug 5 2012, 5:42am
|
The structure yes
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 5 2012, 7:06am
|
Makes sense
|
Shelob'sAppetite
|
Aug 5 2012, 5:15pm
|
Are you messing with me?
|
SirDennisC
|
Aug 5 2012, 10:09pm
|
I'll give you a big "Amen!" for that last paragraph.
|
Eowyn of Penns Woods
|
Aug 5 2012, 4:38am
|
I feel like I'm the odd man out on this.
|
redgiraffe
|
Aug 13 2012, 11:16am
|
|
|
|