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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Well it was a bit like that.

Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Aug 3 2012, 4:44pm


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Well it was a bit like that. [In reply to] Can't Post
The LOTR was deemed to be un-splittable until after it was finished. Tolkien felt it was probably unpublishable and offered to write something shorter which he felt might be more saleable. Now it is not entirely comparable but in that instance it is almost more like Jackson having shot a single 7.5hour film and then deciding afterwards to break it up.

The story itself (and I know you know this, but I'm just reflecting) was nothing like the story he set out to tell - completely different in form, tone and content and much, much longer than originally planned!

I suppose it depends on your underlying assumptions and maybe there was a better LOTR in what Tolkien originally planned. He may have "expanded matters at the expense of the story" but I suppose it turned out quite well.

Now TH may or may not. I suppose all I am saying is that you can get great results not following the plan and adding to the planned scope doesn't always go wrong. In fact we don't really have any evidence to point us either way at the moment (as ever, IMO)

Now on the audience thing though I must be firm in my views. There is a lot of slippage these days but for me the audience's role is simple. We are there to respond to the work and judge it. We aren't there to be involved, have a bit of dabble, design by consensus or anything similar in my view. The reader picks up the book when it's released and doesn't pull up a chair next to the author suggest moving chapters around or making it a bit shorter. We look at a painting in a gallery and would not be thanked for having a pop at remounting it ourselves. Download from ITunes, by all means, but don't sit outside the studio expecting to have a go on the mixing decks.

We all have two fantastic opportunities to exercise our audience role. Firstly if we don't like the look of the work we can choose not to pay to see it - our greatest censure. Secondly we can see it and then respond, internally or externally, and we can judge it to our own standards. But I firmly believe that is our end of the bargain.

It is the artists' work. They can do whatever they want. We are then free to buy it or not, to like it or not. I can't see how else the relationship can be conceived of.

I am not sure what investment we have put in? Or what rights have accrued? I don't understand what pressure we could possibly bring to bear to "demand" anything?

If we don't feel we like the look of the restaurant buffet then we don't have to order, if we don't like the food we can respond and judge it accordingly. I don't think we can pop into the kitchen and start suggesting recipes, personally.

LR


(This post was edited by Lacrimae Rerum on Aug 3 2012, 4:47pm)

Subject User Time
The bold 'Hobbit' trilogy decision and what to expect now News from Bree Send a private message to News from Bree Aug 2 2012, 12:24pm
    Great read - Thank you Larry! DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 2 2012, 10:55pm
        3 months until the premier?... QuackingTroll Send a private message to QuackingTroll Aug 2 2012, 10:57pm
            Not quite MrCere Send a private message to MrCere Aug 2 2012, 10:59pm
            It really is crazy! DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 2 2012, 10:59pm
        I really don't know what's the point of this thread Morok Cloudkeeper Send a private message to Morok Cloudkeeper Aug 2 2012, 11:35pm
            It's not pointless at all DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 2 2012, 11:38pm
            Out of curiousity - what kind of posts do you prefer reading? // Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 2 2012, 11:49pm
                The ones that do not bore me. Morok Cloudkeeper Send a private message to Morok Cloudkeeper Aug 2 2012, 11:53pm
                    I don't like reading boring stuff, either. Magpie Send a private message to Magpie Aug 3 2012, 4:14pm
                        No my friend Morok Cloudkeeper Send a private message to Morok Cloudkeeper Aug 3 2012, 4:19pm
                            well... just scanning subject lines : at least 8 Magpie Send a private message to Magpie Aug 3 2012, 4:51pm
                                Wisely said Morok Cloudkeeper Send a private message to Morok Cloudkeeper Aug 3 2012, 9:47pm
                                    The "you can't really read tone on the internet" defense would go right out the window! ;) // Eowyn of Penns Woods Send a private message to Eowyn of Penns Woods Aug 3 2012, 10:37pm
            I feel similar... I don't have any interest in the 3 movies news... QuackingTroll Send a private message to QuackingTroll Aug 3 2012, 12:05am
                Me too Morok Cloudkeeper Send a private message to Morok Cloudkeeper Aug 3 2012, 12:09am
                    Nailed it Elessar Send a private message to Elessar Aug 3 2012, 12:15am
            um... Lindele Send a private message to Lindele Aug 3 2012, 8:01pm
    I fully agree with you until the point where you discuss the breaking of the films, painjoiker Send a private message to painjoiker Aug 2 2012, 11:03pm
    Very enjoyable read MrCere SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 2 2012, 11:18pm
    Awesome post! Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 2 2012, 11:19pm
        Fellowship felt very, very rushed Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Aug 4 2012, 9:06pm
    While I was reading the post.... Jim Send a private message to Jim Aug 2 2012, 11:24pm
        On paper it's a nice idea. DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 2 2012, 11:34pm
            Endless stair Morok Cloudkeeper Send a private message to Morok Cloudkeeper Aug 2 2012, 11:58pm
                If they wanted to add more scenes DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 3 2012, 12:04am
        I always hoped he would! Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 2 2012, 11:46pm
    Benefit of having dwarves' imprisonment as ending to Film 1... Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 2 2012, 11:40pm
        Oooh ... I like it. DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 2 2012, 11:58pm
    Encoding JWPlatt Aug 2 2012, 11:55pm
    Nit Pick JWPlatt Aug 3 2012, 12:26am
        good nit pick MrCere Send a private message to MrCere Aug 3 2012, 2:01am
            I wanted to add, given the flavour of the article, SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 3 2012, 2:07am
    Fantastic write up There&ThereAgain Send a private message to There&ThereAgain Aug 3 2012, 2:15am
    Gonna have to disagree on film one break. Ardamírë Send a private message to Ardamírë Aug 3 2012, 2:46am
        2nd break MrCere Send a private message to MrCere Aug 3 2012, 5:35am
    Nice job. This can't be said often enough: Lissuin Send a private message to Lissuin Aug 3 2012, 3:00am
        Disagree Yngwulff Send a private message to Yngwulff Aug 3 2012, 3:11am
        Hey now! MrCere Send a private message to MrCere Aug 3 2012, 5:36am
    I'm calling it for Mirkwood Spaldron Send a private message to Spaldron Aug 3 2012, 3:22am
    I found you're review to be glowing, though I don't know that I agree on some points. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Aug 3 2012, 4:44am
        Yes, clearly possible MrCere Send a private message to MrCere Aug 3 2012, 5:43am
    Wonderful Sunflower Send a private message to Sunflower Aug 3 2012, 6:47am
        my take TheCoon Send a private message to TheCoon Aug 3 2012, 1:47pm
    Well-written and comprehensive article - however, can't agree with the praise for PJ as Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 3 2012, 2:14pm
        BTW, have not made any final judegment...and likely won't be able to do so until Summer of 2014 at the earliest Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 3 2012, 2:18pm
            a shortcut to mushrooms There&ThereAgain Send a private message to There&ThereAgain Aug 3 2012, 2:37pm
                True, the book has been good enough for decades... Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 3 2012, 4:09pm
                    Indirect benefits DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 3 2012, 4:20pm
                        I worry that it may turn people away from the book. One of my sincere concerns is AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Aug 5 2012, 7:19am
                            That is also inevitable DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 5 2012, 8:53am
        Hmmm Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Aug 3 2012, 2:37pm
            Except what I actually said was Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 3 2012, 4:03pm
                Well it was a bit like that. Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Aug 3 2012, 4:44pm
                    Not so much suggesting recipes as reacting after ordering a meal and getting it in three segments several hours apart and caked in fat Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 3 2012, 7:16pm
                        Ha ah ah but it is a buffet not a la carte. Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Aug 3 2012, 8:43pm
                            Of course, Peter is the creator...but IMO, in an instance such as this, it's not unreasonable for the audience to not co-create, but react to PJ's decision... Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 4 2012, 2:55am
                                Yes... Eowyn of Penns Woods Send a private message to Eowyn of Penns Woods Aug 4 2012, 4:57am
                                    I would agree with this Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Aug 4 2012, 11:31am
                                    Amen Sister! AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Aug 5 2012, 7:20am
                                Ah but where does the agreement come in? Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Aug 4 2012, 10:35am
                                    I suppose in this case it's more about presentation than inception... Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 4 2012, 4:07pm
                                        If the end result Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Aug 4 2012, 8:25pm
                                    In any event, still excited to see how this all turns out and hoping for the best! Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 4 2012, 4:19pm
                                Been following this with interest and some amusement... dormouse Send a private message to dormouse Aug 4 2012, 11:22am
                                    True enough...unless I can't decide whether I like the film or not and develop Gollum/Smeagol-esque double personalities! ;) // Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 4 2012, 3:58pm
                                Nay, my dear Captain Salt. Peter is the adaptor AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Aug 5 2012, 7:25am
        There's a part of me -- SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 3 2012, 2:44pm
            Yes, will certainly give them a chance! Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 3 2012, 4:06pm
    Excellent article hasufel Send a private message to hasufel Aug 3 2012, 3:19pm
    The Film 1 Break and Bilbo's Arc Kassandros Send a private message to Kassandros Aug 3 2012, 3:40pm
    Thank you !! peleowyn Send a private message to peleowyn Aug 3 2012, 6:03pm
    Thank you Lindele Send a private message to Lindele Aug 3 2012, 7:58pm

 
 
 

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