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It's time for some BS!



grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 1, 11:27am


Views: 2644
It's time for some BS!

Here's a Book Spoiler of a discussion with Galadriel... for a moment of Tolkien-zen.

From: Of the Noldor in Beleriand: The Silmarillion


..."Now while the city of Gondolin was building in secret, Finrod Felagund wrought in the deep places of Nargothrond; but Galadriel his sister dwelt... ...in Thingol's realm in Doriath. And at times Melian and Galadriel would speak together of Valinor and the bliss of old; but beyond the dark hour of the death of the Trees Galadriel would not go, but ever fell silent...
......on a time Melian said: 'There is some woe that lies upon you and your kin. That I can see in you, but all else is hidden from me; for by no vision or thought can I perceive anything that passed or passes in the West: a shadow lies over all the land of Aman, and reaches far out over the sea. Why will you not tell me more?'
...'For that woe is past,' said Galadriel; 'and I would take what joy is here left, untroubled by memory... ...maybe there is woe enough yet to come, though still hope may seem bright.'
...Then Melian looked in her eyes, and said: 'I believe not that the Noldor came forth as messengers of the Valar, as was said at first: not though they came in the very hour of our need. For they speak never of the Valar, nor have their high lords brought any message to Thingol, whether from Manwë, or Ulmo, or even from Olwë the King's brother... ...For what cause, Galadriel, were the high people of the Noldor driven forth as exiles from Aman? Or what evil lies on the sons of Fëanor that they are so haughty and so fell? Do I not strike near the truth?'
..."Near,' said Galadriel; 'save that we were not driven forth, but came of our own will, and against that of the Valar... ...through great peril and in despite of the Valar for this purpose we came: to take vengeance upon Morgoth, and regain what he stole.'
...Then Galadriel spoke to Melian of the Silmarils, and of the slaying of King Finwë... ...but still she said no word of the Oath, nor of the Kinslaying, nor of the burning of the ships at Losgar. But Melian said: 'Now much you tell me, and yet more I perceive. A darkness you would cast over the long road from Tirion, but I see evil there, which Thingol should learn for his guidance.'
...'Maybe,' said Galadriel; 'but not of me.'"


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 1, 3:25pm


Views: 2547
OMG, thank you for posting one of my favorite passages

This is both lofty and very personal at the same time. We all have experiences with people close to us where we want to leave something dark in our past (and for the record, no, I've never done a Kinslaying or burned anyone's ships). But as much as we hide, by the nature of being close, the other person/people usually see right through you and guess that *something* is there.

Besides that, I like how both characters are developed through this back and forth, because they don't get a lot of development in The Sil. *big hug to you, Gramma!*


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 2, 10:52am


Views: 2535
It's time for some more BS!

It's part one of a 2-part Book Spoiler about Frodo's unique understanding of Gollum... for a moment of Tolkien-zen.

From The Taming of Sméagol: The Two Towers


..."'Your rope might prove useful again, Sam,' [Frodo] said.
... Sam got out the rope. 'And where were you off to in the cold hard lands, Mr. Gollum?' he growled. 'We wonders, aye... ...To find some of your orc-friends, I warrant. You nasty treacherous creature. It's round your neck this rope ought to go, and a tight noose too.'
... Gollum lay quiet and tried no further tricks. He did not answer Sam, but gave him a swift venomous look.
... 'All we need is something to keep a hold on him,' said Frodo. 'We want him to walk, so it's no good tying his legs—or his arms, he seems to use them nearly as much. Tie one end to his ankle, and keep a grip on the other end.'
... He stood over Gollum, while Sam tied the knot. The result surprised them... ...Gollum began to scream, a thin, tearing sound, very horrible to hear. He writhed, and tried to get his mouth to his ankle and bite the rope. He kept on screaming....
... ...Frodo was convinced that he really was in pain; but it could not be from the knot. He examined it and found that it was not too tight... ...Sam was gentler than his words. 'What's the matter with you?' he said. 'If you will try to run away, you must be tied; but we don't wish to hurt you.'
... 'It hurts us, it hurts us,' hissed Gollum. 'It freezes, it bites! Elves twisted it, curse them! Nasty cruel hobbits! That's why we tries to escape, of course it is, precious. We guessed they were cruel hobbits. They visits Elves, fierce Elves with bright eyes. Take it off us! It hurts us.'
... 'No, I will not take it off you,' said Frodo... ...he paused a moment in thought -- 'not unless there is any promise you can make that I can trust.'
... 'We will wear to do what he wants, yes, yess,' said Gollum, still twisting and grabbling at his ankle. 'It hurts us.'
... 'Swear?' said Frodo.
... 'Sméagol,' said Gollum suddenly and clearly, opening his eyes wide and staring at Frodo with a strange light. 'Sméagol will swear on the Precious.'
... Frodo drew himself up, and again Sam was startled by his words and his stern voice. 'On the Precious? How dare you...!'"



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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 2, 11:02am


Views: 2535
:) Well said!

Wisdom of Tolkien's... and another example of Galadriel's strength carrying a burden.
Thank you :)


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 3, 11:24am


Views: 2526
It's time for some MORE BS!

It's part 2 of a 2-part Book Spoiler about Frodo's unique understanding of Gollum... for a moment of Tolkien-zen.

From The Taming of Sméagol: The Two Towers


... "Frodo drew himself up, and again Sam was startled by his words and his stern voice. 'On the Precious? How dare you?' he said. 'Think!

One Ring to rule them all and in the Darkness bind them.


Would you commit your promise to that, Sméagol? It will hold you. But it is more treacherous than you are. It may twist your words. Beware!'
... Gollum cowered. 'On the Precious, on the Precious...!'
... '...And what would you swear?' asked Frodo.
... 'To be very very good,' said Gollum. Then crawling to Frodo's feet he grovelled before him whispering hoarsely: a shudder ran over him, as if the words shook his very bones with fear. 'Sméagol will swear never... ...to let Him have it. Never! Sméagol will save it. But he must swear on the Precious.'
... 'No! not on it,' said Frodo, looking down at him with stern pity. 'All you wish is to see it and touch it, if you can, though you know it would drive you mad. Not on it. Swear by it... ...For you know where it is. Yes, you know, Sméagol. It is before you.'
... For a moment it appeared to Sam that his master had grown and Gollum had shrunk: a tall stern shadow, a mighty lord who hid his brightness in grey cloud, and at his feet a little whining dog. Yet the two were in some way akin... ...not alien: they could reach one another's minds. Gollum raised himself and began pawing at Frodo, fawning at his knees.
... 'Down! down!' said Frodo. 'Now speak your promise!'
... 'We promises, yes, I promise!' said Gollum. 'I will serve the master of the Precious. Good master, good Sméagol, gollum, gollum!' Suddenly he began to weep and bite at his ankle again.
... 'Take the rope off, Sam!' said Frodo."


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(This post was edited by grammaboodawg on Aug 3, 11:25am)


CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 3, 1:41pm


Views: 2517
That Ring has to be pretty darn treacherous

to outdo Gollum. Smile


In Reply To
Would you commit your promise to that, Sméagol? It will hold you. But it is more treacherous than you are. It may twist your words. Beware!'



grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 3, 9:26pm


Views: 2479
So true.

And I'm sure Frodo knows this because of his own experience with the Ring's influence. Treacherous. *shudder*


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 4, 1:15pm


Views: 2406
It's time for even more BS!

This is a Book Spoiler that says so much about Bilbo... for a moment of Tolkien-zen.

From A Thief in the Night: The Hobbit

... ""Why do you tell us this? Are you betraying your friends, or are you threatening us?" asked Bard grimly.
... "My dear Bard!" squeaked Bilbo. "Don't be so hasty! I never met such suspicious folk! I am merely trying to avoid trouble for all concerned. Now I will make you an offer!!"
... "Let us hear it!" they said.
... "You may see... ...It is this!" and he drew forth the Arkenstone, and threw away the wrapping.
... The Elvenking himself, whose eyes were used to things of wonder and beauty, stood up in amazement. Even Bard gazed marvelling at it in silence. It was as if a globe had been filled with moonlight and hung before them in a net woven of the glint of frosty stars.
... "This is the Arkenstone of Thrain," said Bilbo, "the Heart of the Mountain; and it is also the heart of Thorin. He values it above a river of gold. I give it to you. It will aid you in your bargaining." Then Bilbo, not without a shudder, not without a glance of longing, handed the marvellous stone to Bard, and he held it in his hand, as though dazed.
... "But how is it yours to give?" he asked at last with an effort.
... "O well!" said the hobbit uncomfortably. "It isn't exactly... ...I am willing to let it stand against all my claim, don't you know. I may be a burglar—or so they say: personally I never really felt like one—but I am an honest one, I hope... ...Anyway I am going back now, and the dwarves can do what they like to me. I hope you will find it useful."
... The Elvenking looked at Bilbo with a new wonder. "Bilbo Baggins... ...You are more worthy to wear the armour of elf-princes than many that have looked more comely in it. But I wonder if Thorin Oakenshield will see it so. I have more knowledge of dwarves in general than you have perhaps. I advise you to remain with us, and here you shall be honoured and thrice welcome."
... "Thank you very much I am sure," said Bilbo with a bow. "But I don't think I ought to leave my friends like this, after all we have gone through together. And I promised to wake old Bombur at midnight... ...Really I must be going, and quickly."
... Nothing they could say would stop him; so an escort was provided for him, and as he went both the king and Bard saluted him with honour. As they passed through the camp an old man wrapped in a dark cloak, rose from a tent door where he was sitting and came towards them.
... "Well done! Mr. Baggins!" he said, clapping Bilbo on the back. "There is always more about you than anyone expects!" It was Gandalf.
... For the first time for many a day Bilbo was really delighted. But there was no time for all the questions that he immediately wished to ask.""


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 5, 12:02pm


Views: 2299
It's time for a bit more BS!

This is a Book Spoiler about the effect of the Ring when it's put on... for a moment of Tolkien-zen.

From The Choices of Master Samwise: The Two Towers


..."Only a few steps; and now only a few more and he would be going down and would never see that high place again. And then suddenly he heard cries and voices. He stood still as stone. Orc-voices. They were behind him and before him... ...He wheeled round. He saw small red lights, torches, winking away below there as they issued from the tunnel. At last the hunt was up. The red eye of the tower had not been blind. He was caught...
......In a minute they would reach the top and be on him. He had taken too long in making up his mind, and now it was no good. How could he escape, or save himself, or save the Ring? The Ring. He was not aware of any thought or decision. He simply found himself drawing out the chain and taking the Ring in his hand. The head of the orc-company appeared in the Cleft right before him. Then he put it on.
...The world changed, and a single moment of time was filled with an hour of thought. At once he was aware that hearing was sharpened while sight was dimmed... ...All things about him now were not dark but vague; while he himself was there in a grey hazy world, alone, like a small black solid rock, and the Ring, weighing down his left hand, was like an orb of hot gold. He did not feel invisible at all, but horribly and uniquely visible; and he knew that somewhere an eye was searching for him.
...He heard the crack of stone, and the murmur of water far off in Morgul Vale; and down away under the rock the bubbling misery of Shelob... ...and voices in the dungeons of the tower; and the cries of the Orcs... ...deafening, roaring in his ears, the crash of the feet and the rending clamour of the Orcs before him. He shrank against the cliff. But they marched up like a phantom company, grey distorted figures in a mist, only dreams of fear with pale flames in their hands. And they passed him by. He cowered, trying to creep away into some cranny and to hide.
...He listened. The Orcs from the tunnel and the others marching down had sighted one another, and both parties were now hurrying and shouting. He heard them both clearly, and he understood what they said. Perhaps the Ring gave understanding of tongues, or simply understanding, especially of the servants of Sauron its maker, so that if he gave heed, he understood and translated the thought to himself."


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 6, 12:54pm


Views: 2263
It's time for another bit of BS!

Here's a Book Spoiler of a beginning... for a moment of Tolkien-zen

From Of Men: The Silmarillion


]... " At the first rising of the Sun the Younger Children of Ilúvatar awoke in the land of Hildórien in the eastward regions of Middle-earth; but the first Sun arose in the West, and the opening eyes of Men were turned towards it, and their feet as they wandered over the Earth... ...strayed that way. The Atani they were named by the Eldar, the Second People; but they called them also Hildor, the Followers, and many other names: Apanónar, the After-born, Engwar, the Sickly, and Fírimar, the Mortals; and they named them the Usurpers, the Strangers, and the Inscrutable, the Self-cursed, the Heavy-handed, the Night-fearers, the Children of the Sun. Of Men little is told... ...which concern the Eldest Days before the waxing of mortals and the waning of the Elves, save of those fathers of men, the Atanatári, who in the first years of the Sun and Moon wandered into the North of the world. To Hildórien there came no Vala to guide Men, or to summon them to dwell in Valinor; and Men have feared the Valar, rather than loved them, and have not understood the purposes of the Powers, being at variance with them, and at strife with the world."


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 7, 11:04am


Views: 2220
TIME - August 7

Today in Middle-earth

August 7, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. Bilbo and the Dwarves are on Forest Trail in Mirkwood.
(determined from text - referencing Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."It was not long before they grew to hate the forest as heartily as they had hated the tunnels of the goblins, and it seemed to offer even less hope of any ending. But they had to go on and on, long after they were sick for a sight of the sun and of the sky, and longed for the feel of wind on their faces."


The Great Years
August 7, 3018 (S.R. 1418)
1. Frodo waited for Gandalf's return as he made plans to leave the Shire.
(not from the appendices—general time frame from book)

..."Gandalf had left the suddenly after hearing something that made him anxious and needed looking into. At first Frodo was a good deal disturbed, and wondered often what Gandalf could have heard; but this uneasiness wore off, and in the fine weather he forgot his troubles for a while. The Shire had seldom seen so fair a summer..."

2. All trace of Gollum is lost.
[It is thought that at about this time, being hunted both by the Elves and Sauron's servants, he took refuge in Moria; but when he had at last discovered the way to the West-gate he could not get out. There is no real account of this other than references from others. This excerpt is from the Council of Elrond as an explanation of how Gollum escaped and was thus lost]

(from the appendices--repeated from June 20th post)
..."It was that very night of summer, yet moonless and starless, that Orcs came on us [Mirkwood Elves] at unawares. We drove them off after some time; they were many and fierce... ...they came from over the mountains, and were unused to the woods. When the battle was over, we found that Gollum was gone, and his guards were slain or taken. It then seemed plain to us that the attack had been made for his rescue, and that he knew of it beforehand. How that was contrived we cannot guess; but Gollum is cunning... ...The dark things that were driven out in the year of the Dragon's fall have returned in greater numbers, and Mirkwood is again an evil place, save where our realm is maintained.
...'We have failed to recapture Gollum. We came on his trail among those of many Orcs, and it plunged deep into the Forest, going south. But... ...it escaped our skill, and we dared not continue the hunt; for we were drawing nigh to Dol Guldur, and that is still a very evil place; we do not go that way.'"


August 7, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. The escort comes to Edoras.
(from the appendices)

..."At length after fifteen days of journey the wain of King Théoden passed through the green fields of Rohan and came to Edoras; and there they all rested. The Golden Hall was arrayed with fair hangings and it was filled with light, and there was held the highest feast that it had known since the days of its building. For after three days the Men of the Mark prepared the funeral of Théoden..."


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 8, 10:44am


Views: 2181
TIME - August 8

Today in Middle-earth

August 8, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. Nights without lights.
(determined from text - referencing Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."...they tried lighting watch-fires at night, but they soon gave that up... ...it brought thousands of dark-grey and black moths, some nearly as big as your hand, flapping and whirring round their ears. They could not stand that, nor the huge bats, black as a top-hat, either; so they gave up fires and sat at night and dozed in the enormous uncanny darkness.
...All this went on for what seemed to the hobbit ages upon ages; and he was always hungry, for they were extremely careful with their provisions... ...they began to get anxious. The food would not last for ever: it was in fact already beginning to get low. They tried shooting at the squirrels, and they wasted many arrows before they managed to bring one down on the path. But when they roasted it, it proved horrible to taste, and they shot no more squirrels."


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 8, 3:48pm


Views: 2162
I'm glad those names didn't stick into the current Age


Quote
" At the first rising of the Sun the Younger Children of Ilúvatar awoke in the land of Hildórien in the eastward regions of Middle-earth; but the first Sun arose in the West, and the opening eyes of Men were turned towards it, and their feet as they wandered over the Earth... ...strayed that way. The Atani they were named by the Eldar, the Second People; but they called them also Hildor, the Followers, and many other names: Apanónar, the After-born, Engwar, the Sickly, and Fírimar, the Mortals; and they named them the Usurpers, the Strangers, and the Inscrutable, the Self-cursed, the Heavy-handed, the Night-fearers, the Children of the Sun.

Nothing like a little Elvish name-calling and bigotry. Remember that rule about if you don't have anything nice to say, then...? Smile


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 9, 11:15am


Views: 2141
TIME - August 9

Today in Middle-earth

August 9, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. The Company's suffering grows.
(determined from text - referencing Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."They were thirsty... ...for they had none too much water, and in all the time they had seen neither spring nor stream. [Even if they found one stream in particular, they'd be out of luck.] It was well that Beorn had warned them against it..."

[From Queer Lodgings]
""...I will provide you with skins for carrying water, and I will give you some bows and arrows. But I doubt very much whether anything you find in Mirkwood will be wholesome to eat or to drink. There is one stream there... ...black and strong which crosses the path. That you should neither drink of, nor bathe in; for I have heard that it carries enchantment and a great drowsiness and forgetfulness. And in the dim shadows of that place I don't think you will shoot anything, wholesome or unwholesome, without straying from the path. That you MUST NOT do, for any reason.""


August 9, 1973
Tolkien visits the Botanic Garden, Oxford, with his grandson Michael George, who photographs him standing with his favorite tree, a Pinus Negra. This is the last known published photograph of Tolkien who passed away less than a month later on September 2nd.


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 9, 11:17am


Views: 2139
*snigger* yeah!

Then don't say anything at all ;) Elves do tend to pontificate!


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dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Aug 9, 12:00pm


Views: 2137
That's one of the best photos of Tolkien!

There's something...Shire-like...about it...as if one might expect Bilbo to come by a moment later and join him in sitting against the tree, and they start in on a conversation of a botanical nature...


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"I desired dragons with a profound desire"


CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 9, 12:41pm


Views: 2131
Much agreement! //

 


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 9, 3:53pm


Views: 2117
oh... I love it :) //

 


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 11, 12:41am


Views: 2084
TIME - August 10

Today in Middle-earth

August 10, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. Funeral of King Théoden [He passed on March 15].
(from the appendices)

..."...[Théoden] was laid in a house of stone with his arms and many other fair things that he had possessed, and over him was raised a great mound, covered with green turves of grass and of white evermind. And now there were eight mounds on the east-side of the Barrowfield.
...Then the Riders of the King's House upon white horses rode round... ...the barrow and sang together a song of Théoden... ...that Gléowine his minstrel made, and he made no other song after. The slow voices of the Riders stirred the hearts even of those who did not know the speech of that people; but the words of the song brought a light to the eyes of the folk of the Mark as they heard again afar the thunder of the hooves of the North and the voice of Eorl crying above the battle upon the Field of Celebrant... ...the tale of the kings rolled on, and the horn of Helm was loud in the mountains, until the Darkness came and King Théoden arose and rode through the Shadow to the fire, and died in splendour, even as the Sun, returning beyond hope, gleamed upon Mindolluin in the morning.

Out of doubt, out of dark, to the day's rising
He rode singing in the sun, sword unsheathing.
Hope he rekindled, and in hope ended;
over death, over dread, over doom lifted
out of loss, out of life, unto long glory.


...But Merry stood at the foot of the green mound, and he wept, and when the song was ended he arose and cried; 'Théoden King, Théoden King! Farewell! As a father you were to me, for a little while. Farewell!'

......At the last when the feast drew to an end Éomer arose and said: 'Now this is the funeral feast of Théoden the King; but I will speak ere we go of tidings of joy, for he would not grudge that I should do so, since he was ever a father to Éowyn my sister. Hear then all my guests... ...Faramir, Steward of Gondor, and Prince of Ithilien, asks that Éowyn Lady of Rohan should be his wife, and who grants it full willing. Therefore they shall be trothplighted before you all.'
...And Faramir and Éowyn stood forth and set hand in hand; and all there drank to them and were glad. 'Thus,' said Éomer, 'is the friendship of the Mark and of Gondor bound with a new bond, and the more do I rejoice.'
...'No niggard are you, Éomer,' said Aragorn, 'to give thus to Gondor the fairest thing in your realm!'
...Then Éowyn looked in the eyes of Aragorn, and she said: 'Wish me joy, my liege-lord and healer!'
...And he answered: 'I have wished thee joy ever since first I saw thee. It heals my heart to see thee now in bliss.'"


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 11, 4:44pm


Views: 2017
Merry was so lucky to bond with Theoden, vs Pippin stuck with Denethor



In Reply To
...But Merry stood at the foot of the green mound, and he wept, and when the song was ended he arose and cried; 'Théoden King, Théoden King! Farewell! As a father you were to me, for a little while. Farewell!'




grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 12, 1:38am


Views: 1996
TIME - August 11

Today in Middle-earth

August 11, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. Bilbo and the Dwarves are on Forest Trail in Mirkwood.
(determined from text - referencing Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."There was no movement of air down under the forest-roof, and it was everlastingly still and dark and stuffy. Even the dwarves felt it, who were used to tunnelling, and lived at times for long whiles without the sight of the sun; but the hobbit, who liked holes to make a house in but not to spend summer days in, felt he was being slowly suffocated."

August 11, 3018 (S.R. 1418)
1. Frodo plans his departure
(not from the appendices-no text)

...Frodo continues with his plans to leave Hobbiton ever watchful for Gandalf's return as Sam secretly gathers clues and information for the Conspirators.

August 11, 3020 (S.R. 1420)
1. The Shire is being restored.
(not from the appendices-no text)

...The Shirelings have the restoration of their lands nearly completed. The Mallorn Party Tree thrives and grows at an accelerated speed along with the other saplings Sam had planted, each with a grain of Lórien dust from his gift of Galadriel.

August 11, 3021 (S.R. 1421)
1. The Red Book entries continue.

(not from the appendices-no text)
...Frodo works steadily on the Red Book of Westmarch as he enjoys his summer with Sam, Rosie and baby Elanor.


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 12, 1:40am


Views: 1996
TIME - August 12

Today in Middle-earth

August 12, 3018 (S.R. 1418)
1. Frodo continues secretly making plans to leave Hobbiton.
(not from the appendices-no text)

...The summer seemed to be slipping away, and Frodo was keenly aware of every moment. Most of the decisions of what would be taken to Crickhollow to keep the illusion that his move was not gossip had been made. He was leaving, and he found himself mourning these last days at Bag End and his life in Hobbiton. Where was Gandalf?
...Frodo secretly began to wonder if he should wait for Gandalf's return on the chance his long absence meant a change in their plan. But things were in motion and could not be altered without raising questions, so he pressed on as he kept watch for the wizard on the road.
...Frodo also wondered what Sam was telling his gaffer, if anything, about going away. Each time Frodo asked what he was doing to prepare for the move, Sam would just tip his head to one side and shrug his shoulders. "I'm going to make sure my gaffer understands my plans, Mr. Frodo. Don't you go worriting about me. You have enough to do. I'll be ready."


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 12, 1:44am


Views: 1995
TIME - August 13

Today in Middle-earth

August 13, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. The guests take leave of King Éomer.
(from the appendices)

..."When the feast was over, those who were to go took leave of King Éomer. Aragorn and his knights, and the people of Lórien and of Rivendell, made ready to ride; but Faramir and Imrahil remained at Edoras; and Arwen Evenstar... ...and she said farewell to her brethren. None saw her last meeting with Elrond her father, for they went up into the hills and there spoke long together, and bitter was their parting that should endure beyond the ends of the world."


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 12, 4:28pm


Views: 1979
A footnote, but a sad one


In Reply To
Arwen Evenstar... ...and she said farewell to her brethren. None saw her last meeting with Elrond her father, for they went up into the hills and there spoke long together, and bitter was their parting that should endure beyond the ends of the world."


I like how Tolkien crawls into the psyche of immortals to see how things would look from their perspective. For Elrond to spend ETERNITY without ever seeing his daughter again--that's a special kind of parental anguish. Reminiscent of Melian and Luthien:


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It is said that Beren and Lúthien returned to the northern lands of Middle-earth, and dwelt together for a time as living man and woman; and they took up again their mortal form in Doriath. Those that saw them were both glad and fearful; and Lúthien went to Menegroth and healed the winter of Thingol with the touch of her hand. But Melian looked in her eyes and read the doom that was written there, and turned away; for she knew that a parting beyond the end of the world had come between them, and no grief of loss has been heavier than the grief of Melian the Maia in that hour.





grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 15, 11:08am


Views: 1942
TIME - August 14

Today in Middle-earth

August 14, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. More guests take leave of Edoras.
(not from the appendices)

..."At the last before the guests set out, Éomer and Éowyn came to Merry... '...Farewell now, Meriadoc of the Shire and Holdwine of the Mark! Ride to good fortune, and ride back soon to our welcome!'
...And Éomer said: 'Kings of old would have laden you with gifts that a wain could not bear for your deeds upon the fields of Mundburg; and yet you will take naught... ...but the arms that were given to you. This I suffer, for indeed I have no gift that is worthy; but my sister begs you to receive this small thing, as a memorial of Dernhelm and of the horns of the Mark at the coming of the morning.'
...Then Éowyn gave to Merry an ancient horn, small but cunningly wrought all of fair silver with a baldric of green; and wrights had engraven upon it swift horsemen riding in a line that wound about it from the tip to the mouth; and there were set runes of great virtue.
...'This is an heirloom of our house... ...made by the Dwarves, and came from the hoard of Scatha the Worm. Eorl the Young brought it from the North. He that blows it at need shall set fear in the hearts of his enemies and joy in the hearts of his friends, and they shall hear him and come to him.'
...Then Merry took the horn, for it could not be refused, and he kissed Éowyn's hand; and they embraced him, and so they parted for that time."


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 15, 11:39am


Views: 1647
Heartbreak...

To spend eternity never seeing your loved ones again... but also knowing these choices will eventually end with their death. So hard....


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 15, 11:43am


Views: 1648
TIME - August 15

Today in Middle-earth

August 15, 2951 (S.R. 1351)
1. Aragorn goes out into the Wild [20 yo].
(from the appendices)

..."...Elrond saw many things and read many hearts. One day, therefore, before the fall of the year he called Aragorn to his chamber, and he said: "Aragorn, Arathorn's son, Lord of the Dúnedain, listen to me! A great doom awaits you, either to rise above the height of all your fathers since the days of Elendil, or to fall into darkness with all that is left of your kin. Many years of trial lie before you. You shall neither have wife, nor bind any women to you in troth, until your time comes and you are found worthy of it....' ...Aragorn took leave lovingly of Elrond; and the next day he said farewell to his mother, and to the house of Elrond, and to Arwen, and he went out into the wild."

August 15, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. Treebeard releases Saruman and Gríma.
(not from the appendices)

..."'I let him go. There was little left of him when he crawled out, and as for that worm-creature of his, he was like a pale shadow. Now do not tell me… …that I promised to keep him safe; for I know it. But things have changed since then. And I kept him until he was... ...safe from doing any more harm. You should know that above all I hate the caging of live things, and I will not keep even such creatures as these caged beyond great need. A snake without fangs may crawl where he will.'
...'You may be right,' said Gandalf; 'but this snake had still one tooth left... ...the poison of his voice, and I guess that he persuaded you, even you Treebeard, knowing the soft spot in your heart. Well, he is gone, and there is no more to be said. But the Tower of Orthanc now goes back to the King… …Though maybe he will not need it.'
...'That will be seen later,' said Aragorn. 'But I will give to Ents all this valley to do with as they will, so long as they keep a watch upon Orthanc and see that none enter it without my leave.'
...'It is locked,' said Treebeard. 'I made Saruman lock it and give me the keys. Quickbeam has them.'
...Quickbeam bowed like a tree bending in the wind and handed to Aragorn two great black keys of intricate shape, joined by a ring of steel..."
...[Treebeard]"...Will you stay here and rest a while? And maybe there are some that would be pleased to pass through Fangorn Forest and so shorten their road home?' He looked at Celeborn and Galadriel.
... But all save Legolas said that they must now take their leave and depart either south or west. 'Come, Gimli!' said Legolas. 'Now by Fangorn's leave I will visit the deep places of the Entwood and see such trees as are nowhere else to be found in Middle-earth. You shall come with me and keep your word... ...we will journey on together to our own lands in Mirkwood and beyond.' To this Gimli agreed, though with no great delight, it seemed.
... 'Here then at last comes the ending of the Fellowship of the Ring,' said Aragorn.... [[NOTE: this is the only place in the book where they are actually called the Fellowship of the Ring]]
... Then Treebeard said farewell to each of them in turn, and he bowed three times slowly and with great reverence to Celeborn and Galadriel. 'It is long, long since we met by stock or by stone, A vanimar, vanimálion nostari!' he said. 'It is sad that we should meet only thus at the ending. For the world is changing: I feel it in the water, I feel it in the earth, and I smell it in the air. I do not think we shall meet again...'
... ...Celeborn said: 'I do not know, Eldest.' But Galadriel said: 'Not in Middle-earth, or until the lands that lie under the wave are lifted up again. Then in the willow-meads of Tasarinan we may meet in the Spring. Farewell..!'
... ...The travellers now rode with more speed, and they made their way towards the Gap of Rohan; and Aragorn took leave of them at last close to that very place where Pippin had looked into the Stone of Orthanc. The Hobbits were grieved at this parting; for Aragorn had never failed them and he had been their guide through many perils.
... 'I wish we could have a Stone that we could see all our friends in,' said Pippin...
... 'Only one now remains that you could use,' answered Aragorn... '...the Palantír of Orthanc the King will keep, to see what is passing in his realm, and what his servants are doing. For do not forget, Peregrin Took, that you are a knight of Gondor... ...I do not release you from your service... ...remember, dear friends of the Shire, that my realm lies also in the North, and I shall come there one day.'
... Then Aragorn took leave of Celeborn and Galadriel; and the Lady said to him: 'Elfstone, through darkness you have come to your hope, and have now all your desire. Use well the days..!'
... ...With that they parted, and it was then the time of sunset... ...they turned and looked back [and] they saw the King of the West sitting upon his horse with his knights about him; and the falling Sun shone upon them... ...the white mantle of Aragorn was turned to a flame. Then Aragorn took the green stone and held it up, and there came a green fire from his hand.""


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 15, 1:28pm


Views: 1643
That's one of the things I'm glad was put in the Appendices


In Reply To
..."...Elrond saw many things and read many hearts. One day, therefore, before the fall of the year he called Aragorn to his chamber, and he said: "Aragorn, Arathorn's son, Lord of the Dúnedain, listen to me! A great doom awaits you, either to rise above the height of all your fathers since the days of Elendil, or to fall into darkness with all that is left of your kin. Many years of trial lie before you. You shall neither have wife, nor bind any women to you in troth, until your time comes and you are found worthy of it....' ...Aragorn took leave lovingly of Elrond; and the next day he said farewell to his mother, and to the house of Elrond, and to Arwen, and he went out into the wild."

If this had been put in the main part of LOTR, presumably somewhere between Bree and Rivendell, it would have been too heavy-handed. "Young man with great fate goes off on adventures."--been there, done that, pass me another book.

And it's little tidbits like this scattered around that help develop characters. I like Elrond a lot and can never quite say why. I think his kind-hearted insight into people is one reason.


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 16, 11:59am


Views: 1579
TIME - August 16

Today in Middle-earth

August 16, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. The Company reaches the Enchanted River.
(from Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."...they found their path blocked by a running water. It flowed fast and strong but not very wide right across the way, and it was black, or looked it in the gloom. It was well that Beorn had warned them against it, or they would have drunk from it... ...and filled some of their emptied skins at its bank. As it was they only thought of how to cross it without wetting themselves in its water. There had been a bridge of wood across, but it had rotted and fallen leaving only the broken posts near the bank.
...Bilbo kneeling on the brink and peering forward cried: "There is a boat against the far bank! Now why couldn't it have been this side!"

..."...Fili picked up the hook when he had drawn it back, rather doubtfully all the same. This time he threw it with greater strength.
..."Steady!" said Bilbo, "you have thrown it right into the wood on the other side now. Draw it back gently." Fili hauled the rope back slowly, and after a while Bilbo said: "Carefully! It is lying on the boat; let's hope the hook will catch."
...It did. The rope went taut, and Fili pulled in vain. Kili came to his help, and then Óin and Glóin. They tugged and tugged, and suddenly they all fell over on their backs. Bilbo was on the lookout... ...caught the rope, and with a piece of stick fended off the little black boat as it came rushing across the stream. "Help!" he shouted, and Balin was just in time to seize the boat before it floated off down the current.
..."It was tied after all," said he… …"That was a good pull, my lads; and a good job that our rope was the stronger..."
......they were all soon on the far bank safe across the enchanted stream. Dwalin had just scrambled out with the coiled rope on his arm, and Bombur (still grumbling) was getting ready to follow, when something bad did happen. There was a flying sound of hooves on the path ahead. Out of the gloom came suddenly the shape of a flying deer. It charged into the dwarves and bowled them over… …High it sprang and cleared the water with a mighty jump. But it did not reach the other side in safety. Thorin was the only one who had kept his feet and his wits. As soon as they had landed he had bent his bow and fitted an arrow in case any hidden guardian of the boat appeared. Now he sent a swift and sure shot into the leaping beast. As it reached the further bank it stumbled. The shadows swallowed it up, but they heard the sound of hooves quickly falter and then go still.
...Before they could shout in praise of the shot... ...a dreadful wail from Bilbo put all thoughts of venison out of their minds. "Bombur has fallen in! Bombur is drowning!" he cried. It was only too true. Bombur had only one foot on the land when the hart bore down on him, and sprang over him. He had stumbled, thrusting the boat away from the bank, and then toppled back into the dark water….
......They could still see his hood above the water when they ran to the bank. Quickly they flung a rope with a hook towards him. His hand caught it, and they pulled him to the shore. He was drenched from hair to boots... ...When they laid him on the bank he was already fast asleep, with one hand clutching the rope so tight that they could not get it from his grasp; and fast asleep he remained in spite of all they could do."


[[The Enchanted Stream is never called a “river” in the text. Only on CJRT’s map is it labeled “Enchanted R.”...from Bracegirdle 8/10/14]]


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 16, 12:16pm


Views: 1576
The way Tolkien brought Strider into the story

I was really fascinated by this mysterious Ranger... so intense and so mysterious. How he got the hobbits slowly to trust him. There were so many layers to him until you finally learned who he was. To read this later in the Appendices was incredible. A wonderful reveal of an important character you still wouldn't know until you read the appendices.

I know what you mean about Elrond, too. He had so much wisdom and enforced the ways of the elves in how he ruled his realm, but he was very sensitive to the burdens of others as individuals and/or fateful obligation.


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 16, 3:06pm


Views: 1570
Yes, exactly


Quote
I was really fascinated by this mysterious Ranger... so intense and so mysterious. How he got the hobbits slowly to trust him. There were so many layers to him until you finally learned who he was. To read this later in the Appendices was incredible. A wonderful reveal of an important character you still wouldn't know until you read the appendices.


We're 100% on the same page here. I didn't trust Strider myself on first read! Though the letter from Gandalf won me over, because I instinctively trusted him (and had read The Hobbit).

And actually, is any other LOTR character introduced with the same ambiguity and mystery as Strider? It's hard to think of any. Even Boromir's distrust of Lorien before they entered it made me think he was wrong, because Elves are always good, so I wasn't swayed by his opinion. Treebeard is mysterious and a little menacing at first, but befriends the hobbits within an hour or less, even putting them on his shoulders. Eomer seems a little rough at first, but still honorable and one of the good guys. Strider--I wasn't as suspicious of him as Sam, but I wasn't as trusting as Frodo.

Anyway, that's why I like finding out more about Strider later, for exactly the the reasons you give.


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 16, 4:26pm


Views: 1562
Bilbo talking with Gandalf

That lovely April day.... "Good Morning." If you didn't know LotR, Gandalf was quite a character as he was slowly revealed, too. Into everyone's business and slowly showing how much he knew about the lands and various kindred and histories of so much while at times quite comical... all while quietly directing everyone in the direction/outcome he had in his sights all-along. Quite the manipulator to achieve safety and peace in Middle-earth. The Shepherd with a long staff.... tamed by pipe and smoke-rings ;)


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 16, 4:58pm


Views: 1560
Good point

Gandalf is mysterious too and revealed by layers. And manipulative, but in a nice way. Smile


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 17, 12:20pm


Views: 1531
It's time for some BS!

Here's a Book Spoiler where Gandalf tells about what he was up to when he left Bilbo and the Dwarves… for a moment of Tolkien-zen.

From The Last Stage: The Hobbit


... "…the elves… … led them across the water to the house of Elrond. There a warm welcome… …and there were many eager ears that evening to hear the tale of their adventures. Gandalf it was who spoke, for Bilbo was fallen quiet and drowsy. Most of the tale he knew, for he had been in it, and had himself told much of it to the wizard on their homeward way or in the house of Beorn… …every now and again he would open one eye, and listen, when a part of the story which he did not yet know came in.
... It was in this way that he learned where Gandalf had been to… …he overheard the words of the wizard to Elrond. It appeared that Gandalf had been to a great council of the white wizards, masters of lore and good magic; and that they had at last driven the Necromancer from his dark hold in the south of Mirkwood.
... "Ere long now," [said Gandalf], "The Forest will grow somewhat more wholesome. The North will be freed from that horror for many long years, I hope. Yet I wish he were banished from the world!"
... "It would be well indeed," said Elrond; "but I fear that will not come about in this age of the world, or for many afterward.""


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dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Aug 17, 12:43pm


Views: 1529
"...but I fear that will not come about..."

Once one has read LotR, re-reading this line sends a shiver up the spine.

I wonder if these lines were included in the original edition of The Hobbit, or added in later? Did you happen to acquire an original Hobbit, gramma?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"I desired dragons with a profound desire"


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 18, 2:07pm


Views: 1466
TIME - August 18

Today in Middle-earth

August 18, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. On the Mirkwood Forest Trail (day 23).
(from Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."...they were burdened with the heavy body of Bombur, which they had to carry along with them as best they could, taking the wearisome task in turns of four each while the others shared their packs. If these had not become all too light in the last few days, they would never have managed it; but a slumbering and smiling Bombur was a poor exchange for packs filled with food however heavy… …time came when there was practically nothing left to eat or to drink. Nothing wholesome could they see growing in the woods, only funguses and herbs with pale leaves and unpleasant smell."

August 18, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. They come to Helms Deep.
(from the appendices)

..."Now the guests were ready, and they drank the stirrup-cup, and with great praise and friendship they departed (from Edoras), and came at length to Helm's Deep… …Then Legolas repaid his promise to Gimli and went with him to the Glittering Caves; and when they returned he was silent, and would say only that Gimli alone could find fit words to speak of them. 'And never before has a Dwarf claimed a victory over an Elf in a contest of words,' said he. 'Now therefore, let us to go Fangorn and set the score right!'"


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 18, 2:27pm


Views: 1465
Yes I did :)

The lines is the same. *shares shiver* The sadness of the Elves was so long because they foresaw the end and then lived through it. *sigh* Makes you wonder... is it better not to know?


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 18, 4:46pm


Views: 1461
If I had to choose, I prefer Elven habitats, but

on this jaunt, I would rather see the Glittering Caves. Visiting Fangorn would be enjoyable for the people there (Treebeard, Quickbeam), but it's not a pleasant place for those on two legs, nor does it want to be. (Maybe it acts differently for Elves.)



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..."Now the guests were ready, and they drank the stirrup-cup, and with great praise and friendship they departed (from Edoras), and came at length to Helm's Deep… …Then Legolas repaid his promise to Gimli and went with him to the Glittering Caves; and when they returned he was silent, and would say only that Gimli alone could find fit words to speak of them. 'And never before has a Dwarf claimed a victory over an Elf in a contest of words,' said he. 'Now therefore, let us to go Fangorn and set the score right!'"



dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Aug 18, 8:38pm


Views: 1454
That may be

the darkest section in the entire text: that there is still an Evil roaming that world. And they do not know that its End - and the end of their part of this particular Story - will be soon coming.

Yeah, I think it's best to not know, so that one can keep going forward, doing what one must, not trying to second-guess oneself, because that could prove disastrous! Unsure


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"I desired dragons with a profound desire"


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 19, 11:33am


Views: 1388
TIME - August 19

Today in Middle-earth

August 19, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. Walk through open beech-woods much of the day.
(from Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."...they came to a part where most of the trees were beeches. They were at first inclined to be cheered by the change, for here there was no undergrowth and the shadow was not so deep. There was a greenish light about them, and in places they could see some distance to either side of the path. Yet the light only showed them endless lines of straight grey trunks like the pillars of some huge twilight hall. There was a breath of air and a noise of wind, but it had a sad sound…. …Their feet ruffled among the dead leaves of countless other autumns that drifted over the banks of the path from the deep red carpets of the forest.
...Still Bombur slept and they grew very weary. At times they heard disquieting laughter. Sometimes there was singing in the distance too. The laughter was the laughter of voices not of goblins, and the singing was beautiful, but it sounded eerie and strange, and they were not comforted, rather they hurried on from those parts with what strength they had left."


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 19, 2:22pm


Views: 1388
Comparing "happy" endings

Your comment made me think of how at the end of LOTR (Grey Havens end), the good guys *have* banished evil from the world, but there's not the happy ending Bilbo had at the end of The Hobbit (after legally proving he was alive again): a rich, eccentric, but happy bachelor. LOTR has Frodo war-wounded and the Elves leaving Middle-earth without showing any excitement for the West in a Pyrrhic victory.

Or some of them. Focusing on Aragorn, Sam, Merry & Pippin, there's a sense of happily ever after. And Bill the Pony too.


VeArkenstone
Lorien

Aug 19, 11:05pm


Views: 1376
Thank you! I especially enjoy the excerpts from The Sil and The Hobbit.

I have had the most difficulty with reading The Sil, its like reading Old English or something. I am finally getting used to it, and am actually enjoying it.

Please, call me Ve.


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 20, 12:42pm


Views: 1345
TIME - August 20

Today in Middle-earth

August 20, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. The Company eats the last of their food at supper, and Bilbo climbs a tree.
(from Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

...""Is there no end to this accursed forest?" said Thorin. "Somebody must climb a tree and see if he can get his head above the roof and have a look around. The only way is to choose the tallest tree that overhangs the path."
...Of course, "somebody" meant Bilbo. They chose him because... ...the climber must get his head above the topmost leaves, and so he must be light enough for the highest and slenderest branches to bear him. Poor Mr. Baggins had never had much practice in climbing trees, but they hoisted him up into the lowest branches of an enormous oak... ...and up he had to go as best he could. He pushed his way through the tangled twigs with many a slap in the eye… …more than once he slipped and caught himself just in time; and at last, after a dreadful struggle in a difficult place where there seemed to be no convenient branches at all, he got near the top. All the time he was wondering whether there were spiders in the tree, and how he was going to get down again (except by falling).
...In the end he poked his head above the roof of leaves... ...Bilbo's eyes were nearly blinded by the light. He could hear the dwarves shouting up at him from far below, but he could not answer, only hold on and blink. The sun was shining brilliantly, and it was a long while before he could bear it … …he saw all round him a sea of dark green, ruffled here and there by the breeze; and there were everywhere hundreds of butterflies. I expect they were a kind of 'purple emperor,' a butterfly that loves the tops of oak-woods, but these were not purple at all, they were a dark dark velvety black without any markings to be seen.
...He looked at the 'black emperors' for a long time, and enjoyed the feel of the breeze in his hair and on his face; but at length the cries of the dwarves, who were now simply stamping with impatience down below, reminded him of his real business. It was no good... ...he could see no end to the trees and the leaves in any direction. His heart, that had been lightened by the sight of the sun and the feel of the wind, sank back into his toes: there was no food to go back to down below.
...Actually... ...they were not far off the edge of the forest; and if Bilbo had had the sense to see it, the tree that he had climbed... ...was standing near the bottom of a wide valley, so that from its top the trees seemed to swell up all round like the edges of a great bowl, and he could not expect to see how far the forest lasted. Still he did not see this, and he climbed down full of despair…. …His report soon made the others as miserable as he was.
..."The forest goes on for ever and ever and ever in all directions…!"
...…That night they ate their very last scraps and crumbs of food...”


August 20, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. They set out from Helm's Deep for Isengard
(not from the appendices-no text)

"From Deeping Comb they rode to Isengard."
It was a two-day journey at a leisurely pace, and the grand party of travellers enjoyed the peaceful journey. There would never again be such a company; Wizard, Elven Lords and Lady, Dwarf, Hobbits and Man riding together in Fellowship through the lands of Middle-earth.


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 20, 12:46pm


Views: 1344
Oh cool! :)

I struggle with the Sil, too... but breaking it down into these snippets helps ;) Well done on diving in!


Thank you!


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 20, 1:47pm


Views: 1342
It seems so unfair

That Frodo couldn't rest at home and enjoy the Shire; but thank goodness for the gift of the Elves... although they lost, too. It's the story of war. Sacrifice and loss. Even those who come home are seldom unchanged. I like to think of Merry and Pippin who seemed to be the least affected; but they do choose Gondor with Elessar as their final resting place. Even Sam eventually makes a choice.


I agree, though. That Aragorn, Sam, Merry & Pippin do have a happy ending and live full lives in their homelands makes me so happy :)


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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 20, 7:41pm


Views: 1330
The Sil was a struggle for me at first too

You're not alone!

But there's payoff in three ways:
1. Some of the stories are really good, such as Beren and Luthien and the battles.
2. Some of the writing is Tolkien at his most lyrical and memorable.
3. It fills in a lot of hints and mysterious references from LOTR (and even The Hobbit), so you get questions answered, along with a better understanding of Middle-earth and its author's view on people and the world.

The character names are overwhelming, the names for places are overwhelming, and unlike LOTR and Hobbit, there's not a central character or ensemble to help follow the narrative all the way through.

YMMV, but I think it helps to read it a chapter or two at a time, whereas the other books are more page-turners. Anyway, enough advice from this Gaffer. Glad you're enjoying it!


CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 20, 7:48pm


Views: 1330
I guess my head canon says

Frodo was miserable in the Shire after the war, and there's a strong sense of defeat in his going West. But once he got there, he lived happily ever after and was a prized guest among Elves, the way Bilbo was in his retirement in Rivendell. And think of him meeting the Valar!!! So, that's compensation for me.

One thing I can appreciate about the effects of the war is Tolkien taking a mature, honest perspective: not everyone was a happy hero, and not everyone was shell-shocked either. Different people had different experiences and different reactions to the war, rather than there being one simple message to take away from it all. So I agree, sacrifice and loss hang heavily over the end of the book, but there are glimpses of happiness too.


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 21, 11:28am


Views: 1315
TIME - August 21

Today in Middle-earth

August 21, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. Bombur awakes in morning and the Company leaves the path when they see the Elves' fire.
(from Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."…when they woke the first thing they noticed was that they were still gnawingly hungry, and the next thing was that it was raining and that here and there the drip of it was dropping heavily on the forest floor. That only reminded them that they were also parchingly thirsty… …The only scrap of comfort there was, came unexpectedly from Bombur.
...He woke up suddenly and sat up scratching his head. He could not make out where he was at all, nor why he felt so hungry; for he had forgotten everything that had happened since they started their journey that May morning long ago... ...There was nothing now to be done but to tighten the belts round their empty stomachs, and hoist their empty sacks and packs, and trudge along the track without any great hope of ever getting to the end before they lay down and died of starvation....

......Balin, who was a little way ahead, called out: "What was that? I thought I saw a twinkle of light in the forest..."
......they saw a red twinkle in the dark; then another and another sprang out beside it. Even Bombur got up, and they hurried along then, not caring if it was trolls or goblins… …when at last they had drawn level with it, it seemed plain that torches and fires were burning under the trees, but a good way off their track.
..."It looks as if my dreams were coming true," gasped Bombur puffing up behind. He wanted to rush straight off into the wood after the lights. But the others remembered only too well the warnings of the wizard and of Beorn.
..."A feast would be no good, if we never got back alive from it," said Thorin.
..."But without a feast we shan't remain alive much longer anyway," said Bombur… …They argued about it backwards and forwards for a long while, until they agreed at length to send out a couple of spies, to creep near the lights and find out more about them. But then they could not agree on who was to be sent… …In the end, in spite of warnings, hunger decided them, because Bombur kept on describing all the good things that were being eaten, according to his dream, in the woodland feast; so they all left the path and plunged into the forest together.
...After a good deal of creeping and crawling they peered round the trunks and looked into a clearing where some trees had been felled and the ground levelled. There were many people there, elvish-looking folk… …sitting on sawn rings of the felled trees in a great circle. There was a fire in their midst and there were torches fastened to some of the trees round about; but the most splendid sight of all: they were eating and drinking and laughing merrily.
...The smell of the roast meats was so enchanting that… …every one of them got up and scrambled forwards into the ring with the one idea of begging for some food. No sooner had the first stepped into the clearing than all the lights went out as if by magic. Somebody kicked the fire and it went up in rockets of glittering sparks and vanished. They were lost in a completely lightless dark and they could not even find one another, not for a long time at any rate. After blundering frantically in the gloom… …and shouting and calling till they must have waked everything in the forest for miles, at last they managed to gather themselves in a bundle and count themselves by touch. By that time they had, of course, quite forgotten in what direction the path lay, and they were all hopelessly lost...

......But that was not the last of the lights in the forest. Later when the night must have been getting old, Kili who was watching then, came and roused them all again, saying:
..."There's a regular blaze of light begun not far away—hundreds of torches and many fires must have been lit suddenly and by magic. And hark to the singing and the harps!"
...After lying and listening for a while, they found that could not resist the desire to go nearer and try once more to get help... ...and out stepped Thorin into their midst.
...Dead silence fell in the middle of a word. Out went all the light. The fires leaped up in black smokes. Ashes and cinders were in the eyes of the dwarves, and the wood was filled again with their clamour and their cries.
...Bilbo found himself running round and round (as he thought) and calling and calling... ...the cries of the others got steadily further and fainter, and though after a while it seemed to him they changed to yells and cries for help in the far distance, all noise at last died right away, and he was left alone in complete silence and darkness...
......So he sat himself down with his back to a tree, and not for the last time fell to thinking of his far-distant hobbit-hole with its beautiful pantries."


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 21, 11:44am


Views: 1308
Well Said... and so true :) //

 


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Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Aug 21, 3:06pm


Views: 1309
Well...


In Reply To
Frodo was miserable in the Shire after the war, and there's a strong sense of defeat in his going West. But once he got there, he lived happily ever after and was a prized guest among Elves, the way Bilbo was in his retirement in Rivendell. And think of him meeting the Valar!!! So, that's compensation for me.


...'Miserable' is an overstatement, I think. It is certain that Frodo could never be fully healed in the Shire--he had suffered too much and his scars (both physical and spiritual) would always remind him of his hardships and ultimate failure. But there had to be moments of satisfaction and even joy as well.

"Change is inevitable. Growth is optional." - DRWolf (after John C. Maxwell)

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Aug 21, 3:07pm)


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 22, 11:18am


Views: 2068
TIME - August 22

Today in Middle-earth

August 22, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. Bilbo fights off spiders; Thorin captured by the Woodland Elves.
(from Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."[Bilbo] sat himself down with his back to a tree, and not for the last time fell to thinking of his far-distant hobbit-hole with its beautiful pantries. He was deep in thoughts of bacon and eggs and toast and butter when... ...he felt something touch him. Something like a strong sticky string was against his left hand, and when he tried to move he found that his legs were already wrapped in the same stuff, so that when he got up he fell over.
...Then the great spider, who had been busy tying him up while he dozed, came from behind him and came at him.... ...He beat the creature off with his hands—it was trying to poison him to keep him quiet... ...until he remembered his sword and drew it out. Then the spider jumped back, and he had time to cut his legs loose. After that it was his turn to attack. The spider evidently was not used to things that carried such stings at their sides... ...Bilbo came at it... ...and struck it with his sword right in the eyes. Then it went mad and leaped and danced and flung out its legs in horrible jerks, until he killed it with another stroke; and then he fell down and remembered nothing more for a long time.
...There was the usual dim grey light of the forest-day about him when he came to his senses. The spider lay dead beside him, and his sword-blade was stained black. Somehow the killing of the giant spider, all alone by himself in the dark without the help of the wizard or the dwarves or of anyone else, made a great difference to Mr. Baggins. He felt a different person, and much fiercer and bolder... ...he wiped his sword on the grass and put it back into its sheath.
..."I will give you a name," he said to it, "and I shall call you Sting."

......he made as good a guess as he could at the direction from which the cries for help had come in the night... ...He had picked his way stealthily for some distance, when he noticed a place of dense black shadow ahead of him black even for that forest, like a patch of midnight that had never been cleared away. As he drew nearer, he saw that it was made by spider-webs one behind and over and tangled with another... ...Bilbo was horrified, now that he noticed them for the first time dangling in the shadows, to see a dwarvish foot sticking out of the bottoms of some of the bundles, or here and there the tip of a nose, or a bit of beard or of a hood.

......The idea came to him to lead the furious spiders further and further away from the dwarves... ...to make them curious, excited and angry all at once. When about fifty had gone off to the place where he had stood before, he threw some more stones at these, and at others that had stopped behind; then dancing among the trees he began to sing a song to infuriate them and bring them all after him, and also to let the dwarves hear his voice. This is what he sang:

Old fat spider spinning in a tree!
Old fat spider can't see me!
Attercop! Attercop!
Won't you stop,
Stop your spinning and look for me!

Old Tomnoddy, all big body,
Old Tomnoddy can't spy me!
Attercop! Attercop!
Down you drop!
You'll never catch me up your tree!


......As he sang he threw some more stones and stamped. Practically all the spiders in the place came after him: some dropped to the ground, others raced along the branches... ...Out came his little sword. He slashed the threads to pieces and went off singing.... ...They followed him into the forest until Bilbo had gone as far as he dared. Then quieter than a mouse he stole back...

......He had precious little time, he knew, before the spiders were disgusted and came back to their trees where the dwarves were hung....
......the other dwarves were working at the rest of the captives, and cutting at the threads with their knives. Soon all would be free...
......Down the dwarves scrambled or jumped or dropped, eleven all in a heap, most of them very shaky and little use on their legs. There they were at last, twelve of them counting poor old Bombur, who was being propped up on either side by his cousin Bifur, and his brother Bofur; and Bilbo was dancing about and waving his Sting; and hundreds of angry spiders were goggling at them all round and about and above. It looked pretty hopeless...
......Then the battle began. Some of the dwarves had knives, and some had sticks, and all of them could get at stones; and Bilbo had his elvish dagger. Again and again the spiders were beaten off, and many of them were killed. But it could not go on for long.... ...In the end Bilbo could think of no plan except to let the dwarves into the secret of his ring... ...He suddenly slipped on his ring, and to the great astonishment of the dwarves he vanished."


August 22, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. They come to Isengard; they take leave of the King of the West at Sunset.
(from the appendices)

..."From Deeping Coomb they rode to Isengard, and saw how the Ents had busied themselves. All the stone-circle had been thrown down and removed, and the land within was made into a garden filled with orchards and trees, and a stream ran through it; but in the midst of all there was a lake of clear water, and out of it the Tower of Orthanc rose still, tall and impregnable...
......For a while the travellers sat where once the old gates of Isengard had stood... ...But presently they heard a voice calling hoom-hom, hoom-hom; and there came Treebeard striding down the path to greet them with Quickbeam at his side.
...'Welcome to the Treegarth of Orthanc!.... ...Will you stay here and rest a while? And maybe there are some that would be pleased to pass through Fangorn Forest and so shorten their road home?' He looked at Celeborn and Galadriel.
...But all save Legolas said that they must now take their leave and depart either south or west. 'Come, Gimli!' said Legolas. 'Now by Fangorn's leave I will visit the deep places of the Entwood and see such trees as are nowhere else to be found in Middle-earth. You shall come with me and keep your word; and thus we will journey on together to our own lands in Mirkwood and beyond.' To this Gimli agreed....
...'...Here then at last comes the ending of the Fellowship of the Ring,' said Aragorn. 'Yet I hope that ere long you will return to my land with the help that you promised.'
...'We will come, if our own lords allow it,' said Gimli. 'Well, farewell, my hobbits! You should come safe to your own homes now, and I shall not be kept awake for fear of your peril. We will send word when we may, and some of us may yet meet at times; but I fear that we shall not all be gathered together ever again.'
...Then Treebeard said farewell... ...and he bowed three times slowly and with great reverence to Celeborn and Galadriel. 'It is long, long since we met by stock or by stone, A vanimar, vanimálion nostari!' he said. 'It is sad that we should meet only thus at the ending. For the world is changing: I feel it in the water, I feel it in the earth, and I smell it in the air. I do not think we shall meet again.'
...And Celeborn said: 'I do not know, Eldest.' But Galadriel said: 'Not in Middle-earth, or until the lands that lie under the wave are lifted up again. Then in the willow-meads of Tasarinan we may meet in the Spring. Farewell!'
...Last of all Merry and Pippin said good-bye to the old Ent, and he grew gayer as he looked at them. 'Well, my merry folk... ...will you drink another draught with me before you go?'
...'Indeed we will,' they said, and he took them aside into the shade of one of the trees...
.
......The travellers now rode with more speed, and they made their way towards the Gap of Rohan; and Aragorn took leave of them at last close to that very place where Pippin had looked into the Stone of Orthanc. The Hobbits were grieved at this parting; for Aragorn had never failed them and he had been their guide through many perils.
...'I wish we could have a Stone that we could see all our friends in,' said Pippin, 'and that we could speak to them from far away!'
...'Only one now remains that you could use,' answered Aragorn... '...But the Palantír of Orthanc the King will keep, to see what is passing in his realm, and what his servants are doing. For do not forget, Peregrin Took, that you are a knight of Gondor, and I do not release you from your service.... ...And remember, dear friends of the Shire, that my realm lies also in the North, and I shall come there one day...'
......With that they parted, and it was then the time of sunset; and when after a while they turned and looked back, they saw the King of the West sitting upon his horse with his knights about him; and the falling Sun shone upon them and made all their harness to gleam like red gold, and the white mantle of Aragorn was turned to a flame. Then Aragorn took the green stone and held it up, and there came a green fire from his hand."


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 23, 11:25am


Views: 2021
TIME - August 23

Today in Middle-earth

August 23, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. The dwarves surrender when surrounded by Elves, but Bilbo uses Ring and disappears.
(from Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."...after the battle with the spiders Bilbo and the dwarves made one last despairing effort to find a way out before they died of hunger and thirst... ...when suddenly out sprang the light of many torches all round them, like hundreds of red stars. Out leaped Wood-elves with their bows and spears and called the dwarves to halt.
...There was no thought of a fight. Even if the dwarves had not been in such a state that they were actually glad to be captured, their small knives, the only weapons they had, would have been of no use against the arrows of the elves... ...So they simply stopped dead and sat down and waited—all except Bilbo, who popped on his ring and slipped quickly to one side. That is why, when the elves bound the dwarves in a long line, one behind the other, and counted them, they never found or counted the hobbit.
...Nor did they hear or feel him trotting along well behind their torch-light as they led off their prisoners into the forest... ...Bilbo had all he could do to keep up with the torches, for the elves were making the dwarves go as fast as ever they could, sick and weary as they were...
......Across this bridge the elves thrust their prisoners, but Bilbo hesitated in the rear. He did not at all like the look of the cavern-mouth and he only made up his mind not to desert his friends just in time to scuttle over at the heels of the last elves, before the great gates of the king closed behind them with a clang."


August 23, 3018 (S.R. 1418)
1. Frodo prepares to leave Bag End.
(not from the appendices)

..."'Merry Brandybuck is looking out for a nice little hole for me, or perhaps a small house.'
...As a matter of fact with Merry's help he had already chosen and bought a little house at Crickhollow in the country beyond Bucklebury. To all but Sam he pretended he was going to settle down there permanently. The decision to set out eastwards had suggested the idea to him; for Buckland was on the eastern borders of the Shire, and as he had lived there in childhood his going back would at least seem credible."


August 23, 3019 (S.R. 1419)
1. The company has parted from the King Elessar
(not from the appendices)

..."Soon the dwindling company, following the Isen, turned west and rode through the Gap into the waste lands beyond, and then they turned northwards, and passed over the borders of Dunland. The Dunlendings fled and hid themselves, for they were afraid of Elvish folk, though few indeed ever came to their country; but the travellers did not heed them, for they were still a great company and were well provided with all that they needed; and they went on their way at their leisure, setting up their tents when they would..."


August 23, 3020 (S.R. 1420)
1. The Shire still recovers
(not from the appendices)

..."Altogether 1420 in the Shire was a marvellous year. Not only was there wonderful sunshine and delicious rain, in due times and perfect measure, but there seemed something more: an air of richness and growth, and a gleam of a beauty beyond that of mortal summers that flicker and pass upon this Middle-earth."


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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 24, 10:31am


Views: 2000
TIME - August 24

Today in Middle-earth

August 24-September 6, 2941 (S.R. 1341)
1. Bilbo tries to adapt to life in hiding.
(determined from text - referencing Karen Wynn Fonstad, The Atlas of Middle-earth)

..."Poor Mr. Baggins---it was a weary long time that he lived in that place all alone, and always in hiding, never daring to take off his ring, hardly daring to sleep, even tucked away in the darkest and remotest corners... ...he took to wandering about the Elvenking's palace. Magic shut the gates, but he could sometimes get out, if he was quick. Companies of the Wood-elves, sometimes with the king at their head, would from time to time ride out to hunt, or to other business in the woods and in the lands to the East. Then if Bilbo was very nimble, he could slip out just behind them... ...which was not very often... ...He did not wish to desert the dwarves, and indeed he did not know where in the world to go without them.... ...He was hungry too outside, for he was no hunter; but inside the caves he could pick up a living of some sort of stealing food from store or table when no one was at hand.
..."I am a burglar that can't get away, but must go on miserably burgling the same house day after day... ...I wish I was back in my hobbit-hole by my own warm fireside with the lamp shining!" He often wished, too, that he could get a message for help sent to the wizard, but that of course was quite impossible; and he soon realized that if anything was to be done, it would have to be done by Mr. Baggins, alone and unaided."



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CuriousG
Half-elven


Aug 24, 6:26pm


Views: 1968
One of Bilbo's turning points

which is why I like this passage a lot. No more "Help me, help me!" from him. Thanks for posting it.

In Reply To
"I am a burglar that can't get away, but must go on miserably burgling the same house day after day... ...I wish I was back in my hobbit-hole by my own warm fireside with the lamp shining!" He often wished, too, that he could get a message for help sent to the wizard, but that of course was quite impossible; and he soon realized that if anything was to be done, it would have to be done by Mr. Baggins, alone and unaided."




grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 24, 9:31pm


Views: 1955
So true

I agree... he really takes a turn here. I also think that this and the Riddle games prepared him to deal with Smaug later on as he honed his theft and dangerous debating skills.



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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 25, 12:07pm


Views: 1914
TIME - August 25

Today in Middle-earth

August 25, 3018 (S.R. 1418)
1. All of Hobbiton whispered and wondered at Frodo's announcement to move to Buckland.
(not from the appendices)

..."...But so firmly fixed had the notion of the immeasurable wealth of the Bagginses of Bag End become that most found this hard to believe, harder than any other reason or unreason that their fancy could suggest: to most it suggested a dark and yet unrevealed plot by Gandalf. Though he kept himself very quiet and did not go about by day, it was well known that he was 'hiding up in the Bag End'. But however a removal might fit in with the designs of his wizardry, there was no doubt about the fact: Frodo Baggins was going back to Buckland.
...'Yes, I shall be moving this autumn,' he said. 'Merry Brandybuck is looking out for a nice little hole for me, or perhaps a small house.'"



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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 26, 10:20am


Views: 1841
TIME - August 26

Today in Middle-earth

August 26, 3020 (S.R. 1420)
(not from the appendices)

..."In the Southfarthing the vines were laden, and the yield of 'leaf' was astonishing; and everywhere there was so much corn that at Harvest every barn was stuffed. The Northfarthing barley was so fine that the beer of 1420 malt was long remembered and became a byword. Indeed a generation later one might hear an old gaffer in an inn, after a good pint of well-earned ale, put down his mug with a sign: 'Ah! that was a proper fourteen-twenty, that was!'"



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VeArkenstone
Lorien

Aug 26, 7:12pm


Views: 1806
Thanks for the encouagement. It is still somewhat of a struggle for me,

but is getting easier. My favorite story so far Elwe and Melion. Love it! I think possibly it was meant to have happened before the Time/Space Continuem was developed, so in the very early days of Arda there was no time as we know it. Just speculating. I do like developing a basic knowledge of the 1st and 2nd ages. Like you say, a little at a time.

Please, call me Ve.


(This post was edited by VeArkenstone on Aug 26, 7:13pm)


VeArkenstone
Lorien

Aug 26, 7:38pm


Views: 1804
Thank you. Here is a story of my history with my copy of the Sil. Its been a

long road. I picked up a copy of the Sil at a garage sell in the early '80s. After carrying it around for years and trying to read it but being unsuccessful, I gave it to my Dad, told him it was unreadable and it was for his library (he has a decent sized library, and collects older books). I would go visit my mom and dad periodically and see The Sil sitting on a shelf in my Dad's library and not think twice about it. About 15 years after giving my Dad the book, FOTR was released. Well, this stirred up a new interest in Tolkien's work, so I thought about The Sil sitting in my Dad's library, and hoped he still had it. He did, sitting in the exact place it had been sitting for the past 15 years. Well, all these years later I still struggle with it, but will never be parted from this book again. When I am not reading it, it has a special place on a shelf in my own library. I love it.

Please, call me Ve.


(This post was edited by VeArkenstone on Aug 26, 7:46pm)


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Aug 26, 8:35pm


Views: 1796
Time and it's Reckoning.


In Reply To
but is getting easier. My favorite story so far Elwe and Melion. Love it! I think possibly it was meant to have happened before the Time/Space Continuem was developed, so in the very early days of Arda there was no time as we know it. Just speculating.


That's an interesting notion, though I don't think it holds up well as a hypothesis. Even ignoring modern physics and looking at this completely as mythology, I would say that the passage of time as we understood it would have had to have begun before the awakening of the Elves. Even in the Spring of Arda, time would have needed to flow as living things stirred to life to live, procreate and die. How time was accounted in a world without Sun or Moon would be an entirely different question. In the time of the Two Trees, one day was said to have lasted for twelve hours. Then there were the Valian Years, each lasting for approximately 9.582 solar years.

"Change is inevitable. Growth is optional." - DRWolf (after John C. Maxwell)

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Aug 26, 8:37pm)


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 26, 9:29pm


Views: 1792
Ahhhhh... a seed was planted

and the tree grew in its own time :D I love how you knew your Dad would keep it safe and tucked in with his own collection.

I had the same sort of scenario when my daughter gave me a 1st ed hc of the Sil when it first came out. Like you, it was a VERY long time before I stuck with it and made it through the entire thing. Also like you, it has a very special place in my heart and on my shelf.



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No One in Particular
Lorien


Aug 27, 2:24am


Views: 1775
Audio


In Reply To
long road. I picked up a copy of the Sil at a garage sell in the early '80s. After carrying it around for years and trying to read it but being unsuccessful, I gave it to my Dad, told him it was unreadable and it was for his library (he has a decent sized library, and collects older books). I would go visit my mom and dad periodically and see The Sil sitting on a shelf in my Dad's library and not think twice about it. About 15 years after giving my Dad the book, FOTR was released. Well, this stirred up a new interest in Tolkien's work, so I thought about The Sil sitting in my Dad's library, and hoped he still had it. He did, sitting in the exact place it had been sitting for the past 15 years. Well, all these years later I still struggle with it, but will never be parted from this book again. When I am not reading it, it has a special place on a shelf in my own library. I love it.


Have you tried the audiobook? I have read it both ways, and it works very well in the audio format.

While you live, shine
Have no grief at all
Life exists only for a short while
And time demands an end.
Seikilos Epitaph


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Aug 27, 10:51am


Views: 1743
So True!

*thwacks my forehead* I keep forgetting to do that... and I have it sitting RIGHT HERE! THANK YOU! :D *sigh*



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VeArkenstone
Lorien

Aug 31, 4:42pm


Views: 1660
The Sil Audio

You know, I never thought of that, what a great idea. Thanks.

Please, call me Ve.


VeArkenstone
Lorien

Aug 31, 6:16pm


Views: 1654
Time/No Time on Middle Earth.

You are right ... but once Elwe takes Melian's hand, something extraordinary happens: Time stands still for them, for decades. If Time is standing still for them, is this the same as experiencing "no time?" Perhaps this happened only to them, since the sapling trees grew to adulthood, the stars still rotated in the sky, seasons still passed, and, like you say, these things require Time to happen. Maybe this occurred because Elwe is a High Elf and one of first to awaken and Melian is a Maia? Perhaps the passage of Time is different for Elves because of their immortality? It is interesting that in the Time of the Two Trees and without the Sun and Moon.as Timekeepers, Time probably would have been different, and, indeed, the days were only twelve hours long.

Each Valian Year was 9,582 solar years long? Are you messing with me? If you are not, how many of these Valian Years were there? So Galadriel would have lived for tens of thousands of years before coming to Middle Earth? Time must have been different for the Valor during these Valian years.

Thanks.

Please, call me Ve.


(This post was edited by VeArkenstone on Aug 31, 6:26pm)


VeArkenstone
Lorien

Aug 31, 6:24pm


Views: 1648
Thank you for sharing this!

I am happy to know that many of us have a "The Sil" story.

Please, call me Ve.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Aug 31, 6:27pm


Views: 1644
Valian Years


In Reply To
Each Valian Year was 9,582 solar years long? Are you messing with me? If you are not, how many of these Valian Years were there? So Galadriel would have lived for tens of thousands of years before coming to Middle Earth? Time must have been different for the Valor during these Valian years.


By the Valar, no! A Valian year was approximately 9.582 solar years long. Nine point five eight two. I'll defer to Tolkien Gateway:


Quote
A Valian year is a reference to the passage of time in Valinor, before the Two Trees were destroyed by Melkor and Ungoliant. Valian years ended with the rising of the Sun during the First Age. There are approximately 9.582 solar years in a Valian year, and 14,325 solar years in the Years of the Trees.


By this reckoning, the Years of the Trees lasted for approximately 1,500.2 Valian years.

"Change is inevitable. Growth is optional." - DRWolf (after John C. Maxwell)

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Aug 31, 6:37pm)


VeArkenstone
Lorien

Aug 31, 6:36pm


Views: 1639
Thank you. The Tolkien Gateway sounds intriging.

 

Please, call me Ve.


No One in Particular
Lorien


Sep 1, 11:34pm


Views: 1616
I really

enjoy the Silmarillion audio myself. I just finished listening to the whole thing, Sil to RoTK, an week or so back.

While you live, shine
Have no grief at all
Life exists only for a short while
And time demands an end.
Seikilos Epitaph