The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: The Arena:
Huan vs Durin's Bane. .



Briza
Bree

Dec 29 2012, 3:42am


Views: 2246
Huan vs Durin's Bane. .
Huan defeated Sauron, probably the most powerful Maia. How would he fair against a Balrog.


DanielLB
Immortal


Dec 29 2012, 10:08am


Views: 1613
Hmmm...
Not sure I would call it a defeat. Didn't Sauron flee? And he did take the shape of a wolf - how would it turn out if Sauron was something else?

But wasn't it prophesied that Huan could only be killed by the greatest wolf? So, Huan would win. Despite the obvious size difference.

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Briza
Bree

Dec 29 2012, 10:14am


Views: 1606
rophesies are not always right...
Yes it was prophesied that Huan would be defeated by the greatest wolf, but prophesies are not always right.

Sauron initially changed into a giant wolf, then into a Serpent, but could not escape from Huan. Sauron was giving the option of death or surrender. He choose to surrendered and flew away as a bat.


DanielLB
Immortal


Dec 29 2012, 10:26am


Views: 1600
Off the top of my head, I'm not aware of any prophecy that didn't come true
In Tolkien's Middle-earth.

I'm sure someone can prove me wrong though ...

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Briza
Bree

Dec 29 2012, 11:03am


Views: 1621
True, most were true.
Some of the prophetic visions from Galadriel's mirror did not come to pass.

Tom was also wrong regarding the Nazgul, but that might not have been a prophecy.

While I agree a lot of the prophecies turned out to be true, there is still a degree of doubt.


Briza
Bree

Dec 29 2012, 6:10pm


Views: 1618
Thought of another example last night....
The Laketown song regarding the return of the king also turned out to be wrong, it was prophesying that the river would run golden with the wealth of the king ect.... turns out to be quite wrong.


BeornBerserker
Lorien

Dec 29 2012, 6:20pm


Views: 1592
Huan
A gift of Orome and slayer of Carcharoth will slay another of Morgoth's servants.


DanielLB
Immortal


Dec 29 2012, 6:48pm


Views: 2234
It wasn't wrong
The prophecy was fulfilled, but not how the Men of Laketown expected. The River ran gold with fire (and Smaug was golden), rather than of the precious metal.

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Narya
The Shire

Jan 12 2013, 5:35pm


Views: 1538
Regarding prophecies
I'm not sure that prophecies are useful in deciding hypothetical contests. It depends what they are and I think they are the results of moment of foresight. That is, they are the same as visions of what has happened, with the exception that they are a vision of what will happen.

For example, if someone with foresight says in 1960 that "only by the hand of Muhammed Ali will George Foreman fall" it is because he has seen what will happen. However even though this did ultimately happen, it doesn't necessarily mean that someone else couldn't have beat George Foreman, it just means that no one that could have beat him ever actually fought him. (In George Foreman's case none of his contempories probably could have beaten him, actually, but hopefully you see the point!)
Even the wise cannot see all ends.


Beren0nehanded
Bree


Jan 16 2013, 3:37pm


Views: 2206
Hummm hummmmm
Indeed Sauron is probably the most powerful Maia, but in combat? Hard to say. Just because he is Morgoth's #2 doesn't mean he is > a Balrog.

Sooo that being said, it is always tough to apply if a > b and b > c than a > c theory in combat. Just because Huan defeated Sauron doesn't mean Huan would also defeat Durin's Bane because like I said, any Balrog might have defeated Sauron in combat.

Tough call, but I give my edge to Durin's Bane.
Don't be hasty.


Nalin sternbolt
The Shire

Jan 28 2013, 1:21am


Views: 2010
for arguement's sake...
I have to side with Durin's Bane...

for this massive creature to just be blown away by Huon... I want to at least give a second look.

Main point: the Balrog's were defeated by either the greatest of the Maier [Gandalf], greatest of the Elves [Glorfindel], or the Vala themselves (Turkas, Orome).

They were the chief weapons of power of the forces of Morgoth... I'm guessing they were more powerful than dragons! (guessing)

Question: The Balrogs slew elves and men en-mass plus fought off the great Ungoliant!! Could Huon have done the same!???
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