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First Spoilers from EMPIRE Dec 2012 Hobbit Special Issue



Eleniel
Tol Eressea


Oct 25 2012, 10:33am


Views: 5786
First Spoilers from EMPIRE Dec 2012 Hobbit Special Issue

I'm still speed-reading the articles (there are 63 pages worth!) but the first spoilers have just hit me between the eyes!!

Firstly, the article reports that Jackson

Quote
"hints the dragon will make a fleeting appearance in the first film, most likely in the prologue, and will remain as liquid tongued as the book's memorable villain (he is a character not a monster)."


Secondly

Quote
"The spiders will speak more as a psychic communication", adds Jackson of Mirkwood's nest of arachnids (now in film two). "Only Bilbo hears them."


Thirdly

Quote

"Talking of subtexts, the Great Goblin, portrayed by Barry Humphries (as in Dame Edna), comes partly based on Kim Jong-il, late, unbeloved Dark Lord of North Korea. Grotesque is the key word here: "He is a rather childish character who enjoys tormenting the dwarves," says Jackson of the ruler of a ramshackle mountain kingdom built on set and in the fathomless mainframes of Weta Digital. "The goblins are a rather putrid, mouldy race of people."



"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort






DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 10:40am


Views: 3326
Just posted this in the other thread (spoilers!)

- Mirkwood is in DOS
- The Mirkwood spiders are physchic
- Radagast, but not Cirdan, is a member of the White Council
- We will see Smaug in DOS
- They've added a plot as to why the Stone (although called Cave in the magazine?) Trolls have come down from the Mountains.

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Carne
Tol Eressea

Oct 25 2012, 11:27am


Views: 3216
There will be (Spoilers)

 an air battle between the eagles and bats in the 3rd film.


(This post was edited by Altaira on Oct 25 2012, 5:42pm)


redgiraffe
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 11:31am


Views: 3028
Really?

Are you for serious, Carne? Don't know why no one considered this as a possibility before.

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 11:38am


Views: 2957
It's always been a possibility?

Both are in the book.

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DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 11:39am


Views: 3034
Can the BO5A get anymore amazing?!

Was this in the scans Carne? I must have read over it! Blush

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redgiraffe
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 11:41am


Views: 2919
well


In Reply To
Both are in the book.


They didn't fight in the book though, did they?

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle


Carne
Tol Eressea

Oct 25 2012, 11:41am


Views: 2983
Yup, last page

Smile


(This post was edited by Carne on Oct 25 2012, 11:47am)


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 11:42am


Views: 2902
Only because Bilbo was knocked out ;-P /

 

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Fardragon
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 11:43am


Views: 2883
It crossed my mind

But the bats would have to be implausibly large to be much of a threat. The CGI would also be very difficult, with all those feathers in an action sequence.

On the other hand, the eagles could simply attack and disperse the bats, allowing sun (or moon) light to daunt the goblins.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Oct 25 2012, 11:59am


Views: 2892
.. .. it is implied logic redgiraffe.. two great aerial forces, they very likely would have clashed, IMO anyway //

 

--I'm a victim of Bifurcation--
__________________________________________

Join us over at Barliman's chat all day, any day!
__________________________________________


TariArFiniel
The Shire


Oct 25 2012, 12:04pm


Views: 2918
Scans?


In Reply To
Was this in the scans Carne? I must have read over it! Blush


Wait! Scans. Where? Please, could someone send a link? Shocked I'm in Germany, so it isn't easy at all to get this magazine...


stoutfiles
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 12:25pm


Views: 2840
Good stuff so far

"The spiders will speak more as a psychic communication", adds Jackson of Mirkwood's nest of arachnids (now in film two). "Only Bilbo hears them."

Hmm, interesting. I suppose it's a compromise between outright talking and keeping with the established traits of LOTR.

Also glad to hear Radagast is a member of the Council. He should be, and it was silly to think he wouldn't be included. Cirdan is a sad omission though, was the actor that played him in LOTR not good enough for speaking roles? I thought that would be a nice touch at the end of ROTK at the docks, to see a character that is firmly established by The Hobbit. Oh well.



SaltedPork
Bree


Oct 25 2012, 12:38pm


Views: 2767
Spider Talk

I didn't know Bilbo was fluent in Arachni-tongue. Wink All joking aside though, maybe he can hear them only when he has the ring on?


Eleniel
Tol Eressea


Oct 25 2012, 12:42pm


Views: 2927
White Council/Dol Guldur

Back from work, still catching up on the reading!

Does this sound like the main DG showdown or perhps something beforehand, such as Gandalf and Radagast investigating the empty tombs?


Quote

Radagast senses Mirkwood's decline into the pestilential. McCoy, with a gleeful gleam in his eye, reveals there is a scene in the second film "where the wizards are together, battling not each other but some other evil."



"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort






dave_lf
Gondor

Oct 25 2012, 12:51pm


Views: 2765
It turns out

that when Sauron killed his parents, he accidentally injected Bilbo with a piece of his soul, and this allows him to understand the speech of spiders.


dave_lf
Gondor

Oct 25 2012, 12:57pm


Views: 2748
Orcrist

It's been obvious for some time, but the blurb on the contents page also contains the first official confirmation (I've seen) that Orcrist's hilt is a dragon tooth.


TheBladeGlowsBlue
Rivendell


Oct 25 2012, 1:04pm


Views: 2670
Missing the point?

Surely, if Mirkwood and the spiders is in film 2, then we have no hope of seeing Smaug at the end of film 1.

Or am I missing something?


The Grey Elf
Grey Havens

Oct 25 2012, 1:12pm


Views: 2674
Smaug will no doubt appear as a flashback

FOTR commenced with a flashback. Perhaps AUJ will as well.


Eleniel
Tol Eressea


Oct 25 2012, 1:21pm


Views: 2773
Dol Guldur will be in DOS confirmation!

In answer to my earlier supposition, confirmation comes in the interview with Hugo Weaving:


Quote

Now The Hobbit has expanded to a trilogy, his [Elrond's] scenes with The White Council at Dol Guldur, dark stronghold of this trilogy's mysterious antagonist, "The Necromancer," have been moved to second film The Desolation of Smaug.



Weaving also goes on to say that he doesn't know yet whether he will be going back to NZ for further filming for the Bo5A, which has yet to be shot:


Quote
"And who's going to be in that?!" Weaving exclaims. "I don't know whether Elrond is, whether I've got more to shoot because of that, whther I'm a part of that. I'm not in the book, but kind of everyone's involved in the book whilst not necessarily named specfically. So you could imagine that Elrond might be there in some way..."



"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort






Eleniel
Tol Eressea


Oct 25 2012, 1:33pm


Views: 2709
Radagast scenes

Interestingly, McCoy reveals in his inteview that he shared most of his scenes wth Ian McKellen's Gandalf...


Quote

...but also appears with the dwarves and Martin Freeman's Bilbo Baggins, and with Cate Blanchett as Galadriel, for which "they didn't even have to pay me." Given Radagast's connection to Saruman....we wonder if McCoy worked with Christopher Lee during his specially mounted, London-based mini-section of the shoot. McCoy says not, but may yet appear in one of the later films with him. The shift from two-parter to trilogy means he has more to shoot next year."I can't predict what will happen in the future," he says. "There are different beginnings and endings to shoot: all sorts of stuff. It's very exciting; none of us have any idea what it's actually going to look like. Peter works in such a way that you do an infinite variety of takes in an infinite variety of ways, so you won't know what your final performance was until you sit down and watch it."



I wonder in what connection Radagast would film with Galadriel if he is not at Rivendell for the Council meeting, according to the publicity shots we've seen so far...


"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort






(This post was edited by Eleniel on Oct 25 2012, 1:34pm)


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 1:35pm


Views: 2634
Sounds like Dol Guldur to me

Or atleast in the Mirkwood area.

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DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 1:36pm


Views: 2620
I have my copy!

And I'm about to start reading!

Had some trouble buying it though - it wouldn't scan through because there not supposed to be on sale yet?!

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Fardragon
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 1:52pm


Views: 2559
There are two White Council "meetings"

One in Rivendell, in AUJ, where Saruman is present but Radagast was absent (because Saruman deliberately didn't invite him, or because he was otherwise engaged?)

Then at Dol Guldur, in DOS, with Radagast present, but Saruman absent.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Oct 25 2012, 1:52pm


Views: 2530
No interaction between Radagast and Saruman?

I can't believe this. PJ, why? Hopefully we get at least something.

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


Elessar
Valinor


Oct 25 2012, 1:53pm


Views: 1115
Sweet!

I'm going hunting this weekend to get me a copy or two. Hopefully the IPad version will be ready tonight so I can read it because it sounds like we're getting some good info. God! I cannot wait for this movie as I truly feel as if this trilogy will be every bit as great as the LOTR was and that makes me misty eyed with happiness. Cool



DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 2:05pm


Views: 1381
Some more spoilers

- Bilbo is sneezed on by a Troll
- There will be a prologue
- Saruman is "up to no good"
- They are digitally de-aging some of the returning actors
- Gloin carries around a picture of his son and wife

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(This post was edited by DanielLB on Oct 25 2012, 2:13pm)


stoutfiles
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 2:09pm


Views: 1125
Good, because Saruman is evil

Saruman is "up to no good"

The film needs to convey that Saurman is stalling so that he can find the Ring. I know the problem with this is that the Ring should not be a big deal in The Hobbit, but the audience already knows it is so no point in hiding it.



Carne
Tol Eressea

Oct 25 2012, 2:09pm


Views: 1116
I actually don't mind de-aging

Both Ian Holm and Christopher Lee looked considerably older in the trailer and vlog.


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Oct 25 2012, 2:17pm


Views: 1128
Two questions

1. Where are the scans?

2. Where are the scans?

Smile


There&ThereAgain
Rohan


Oct 25 2012, 2:20pm


Views: 1062
you and me both

so much to process!

so there is a prologue?

I wonder how dwarven history flashback will function within the frame story?

maybe Bilbo and Frodo are at Rivendell with Gimli and old Gloin?

"The world is indeed full of peril, and in it there are many dark places; but still there is much that is fair; and though in all lands love is now mingled with grief, it grows perhaps the greater."-J.R.R. Tolkien

"Thanks for the money!" -George Lucas


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 2:21pm


Views: 1176
I read too slowly! Some more:

- There's a food fight at Bag End (the magazine says with Baggins, so I'm assume at Bag End)
- Bifur is mentally-challenged and only speaks in Dwarvish. Something happens to his axe, but he can't say what.
- William Kircher plays Tom
- Elijah Wood filmed scenes in London, with Ian Holm

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(This post was edited by DanielLB on Oct 25 2012, 2:30pm)


Carne
Tol Eressea

Oct 25 2012, 2:23pm


Views: 1087
So Peter Hambleton is Bert or William?

Cool


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 2:25pm


Views: 1059
And another one of the Dwarf actors is the other Troll as well.

Edit: It just says they are mo-capping the Trolls. It doesn't say whether they are providing the voices.

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(This post was edited by DanielLB on Oct 25 2012, 2:29pm)


Fardragon
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 2:26pm


Views: 1041
The frame

is in the Shire, the day before the party. That was revealed in the first trailer.

That might be the prologue. Alternatively, the prologue might be Smaug's attack on Erebor and Dale.

Any other bits of dwarven history will probably get slotted in as the Travelling Party travel between the Shire and the Trollshaws, similar to Aragorn's flashbacks whilst travelling from Edoras to Helms Deep.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


There&ThereAgain
Rohan


Oct 25 2012, 2:30pm


Views: 996
yes but

"hints the dragon will make a fleeting appearance in the first film, most likely in the prologue, and will remain as liquid tongued as the book's memorable villain (he is a character not a monster)."

This indicates that there might be a more extensive prologue of Dwarven History before the start of the frame or hobbit story proper...

"The world is indeed full of peril, and in it there are many dark places; but still there is much that is fair; and though in all lands love is now mingled with grief, it grows perhaps the greater."-J.R.R. Tolkien

"Thanks for the money!" -George Lucas


Fardragon
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 2:34pm


Views: 967
Maybe

but it could just as easily be later, when Thorin explains the quest to Bilbo.

And it won't feature much more than the dragon attack - especially if it's at the start.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


There&ThereAgain
Rohan


Oct 25 2012, 2:36pm


Views: 990
I understand that The Hobbit frame bit is at Bilbo's party

but again, that quote indicates that Smaug will appear in A PROLOGUE of some sort, and prologues usually occur at the beginning of a film, if I'm not mistaken. Crazy

Maybe the fireworks display will remind Bilbo of Smaug, and we will get a flashback that way. Wink

"The world is indeed full of peril, and in it there are many dark places; but still there is much that is fair; and though in all lands love is now mingled with grief, it grows perhaps the greater."-J.R.R. Tolkien

"Thanks for the money!" -George Lucas


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 2:38pm


Views: 1044
More

- There is a "little lovely scene" between Elrond and Bilbo
- Hugo Weaving hints he might have some sort of role in the BO5A , but is unsure since Elrond isn't present in the book.
- Radagast is described as a kind of "herbalist" - looking after the Forest, until he discovers the arrival of "evil"
- Radagast will be in scenes with Galadriel. Lee didn't film any scenes in London which involved Radagast, but there might be some later on.

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Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Oct 25 2012, 2:41pm


Views: 1053
Reading the scans

Another spoiler:

"The Lonely Mountain is likely in the third (film)."


I knew it! Wink But that seems to be contradicted by other statements throughout the article...

And, the author states:

"No word on Cirdan the Shipwright."


He does NOT say, however, that Cirdan is definitely not on the Council. He may simply be a non-speaking background character that PJ didn't bother mentioning.


(This post was edited by Shelob'sAppetite on Oct 25 2012, 2:48pm)


redgiraffe
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 2:48pm


Views: 940
Yes I agree


In Reply To
it is implied logic redgiraffe.. two great aerial forces, they very likely would have clashed, IMO anyway


My point was that I haven't seen any speculation about this happening in the films even though it seems like a logical and unsurprising way of adapting that part of the battle. When carne said they would battle I simple thought to myself, "well that makes sense. I can't believe we didn't see that one coming!"Smile

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle


painjoiker
Grey Havens


Oct 25 2012, 3:23pm


Views: 872
So now I am the only one without the scans, eh? //

 

Vocalist in the semi-progressive metal band Arctic Eclipse


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 3:24pm


Views: 924
Not for long

Link

Source

Smile

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(This post was edited by DanielLB on Oct 25 2012, 3:25pm)


Fardragon
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 3:24pm


Views: 842
Maybe everyone else felt is was too obvious to be worth mentioning?

Wink

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


Thoromir
Rivendell


Oct 25 2012, 3:26pm


Views: 859
But you dó already have your tickets for December! (I've got nothing whatsoever:s)//

 



(This post was edited by Thoromir on Oct 25 2012, 3:27pm)


redgiraffe
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 3:32pm


Views: 796
hehe


In Reply To
Maybe everyone else felt is was too obvious to be worth mentioning?Wink


I'm always the slow oneTongue.

It sounds pretty cool though! I wonder if they will be giant sized bats.

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle


redgiraffe
Rohan

Oct 25 2012, 3:33pm


Views: 801
scans?

DanielLB, those links lead me to nowhere! You trying to mess with us?Cool

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Oct 25 2012, 3:36pm


Views: 867
Careful linking to it here

As Empire may take notice, and ask for them to be taken down.


painjoiker
Grey Havens


Oct 25 2012, 3:37pm


Views: 803
Haha! Yeah, I am looking at them right now!

And Daniel was kind enough to link the scans Smile
So thanks Daniboy! (hopefully he'll see it even though I didn't reply to him)

Vocalist in the semi-progressive metal band Arctic Eclipse


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 3:38pm


Views: 817
I see everything! :-D /

 

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Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Oct 25 2012, 3:39pm


Views: 987
Yay for prologue! //

 

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


Pousette
Rivendell


Oct 25 2012, 3:44pm


Views: 1033
We've already seen Glóin's picture in his locket =)

http://heirsofdurin.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/16gloin.jpg


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 3:45pm


Views: 993
What Eleniel wrote...


In Reply To
Surely, if Mirkwood and the spiders is in film 2, then we have no hope of seeing Smaug at the end of film 1.

Or am I missing something?



Apparently, you missed what Eleniel wrote in the original post:


Quote

Firstly, the article reports that Jackson

Quote
"hints the dragon will make a fleeting appearance in the first film, most likely in the prologue, and will remain as liquid tongued as the book's memorable villain (he is a character not a monster)."



'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 25 2012, 3:46pm


Views: 952
Must be Gloin's wife then

Since it doesn't look like Gimli.
Smile

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Elenorflower
Gondor


Oct 25 2012, 6:59pm


Views: 757
are there scans?

I cant find any. Frown and my palantir is bust. Mad


Carne
Tol Eressea

Oct 25 2012, 8:23pm


Views: 780
Adam Brown posted his Empire interview on Twitter!

https://pbs.twimg.com/...kLCIAExlHa.jpg:large


(This post was edited by Carne on Oct 25 2012, 8:26pm)


Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Oct 26 2012, 12:17am


Views: 638
Apologies if I've missed it in another thread but the trolls bIt seems interesting

The idea that the trolls being in Rhuadur links back to them being driven out of the mountains and that this acts as a clue to Gandalf (presumably that evil things are stirring).

I rather like that.

LR


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Oct 26 2012, 4:57am


Views: 525
Agreed

I loved the FOTR prologue, and think it is a great way to immediately immerse the audience in a secondary reality.


Fardragon
Rohan

Oct 26 2012, 6:47am


Views: 494
A matter of taste I guess.

I felt the FotR prologue looked a bit cheesy. I preferred the EE "concerning hobbits" prologue. I also preferred the TT prologue.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


thomasofrohan
Lorien

Oct 26 2012, 6:55am


Views: 509
The FotR prologue was extremely well-done, IMO.

Beautifully shot and expertly narrated by Cate Blanchett.


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Oct 26 2012, 7:00am


Views: 498
The only bit that looked cheesy

Was the Last Alliance bit, which featured some of the worst CGI in all three films, IMO.

What did you find cheesy about it?


Fardragon
Rohan

Oct 26 2012, 7:08am


Views: 506
That bit!

I guess I would have preferred a more gradual revelation of the plot, as in the book, but I can see why they didn't go that route.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...

(This post was edited by Fardragon on Oct 26 2012, 7:10am)


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Oct 26 2012, 7:14am


Views: 472
Understood

But apart from the Last Alliance battle, the rest of the prologue is very lovely, with beautiful images, dialogue and music. IMO, parts of the prologue, bits of the TTT opening, many of the Shire scenes, and some of the scenes in Rohan, are almost in another class than the rest of the films. To me, it is as if a superior director created those scenes, and someone much less talented came in and filled out the remaining 9 hours.


Elenorflower
Gondor


Oct 26 2012, 12:01pm


Views: 426
oh how I want to find that magazine

and have a good read. Frown but all I find is Octobers edition in the shops.Mad maybe my country wont have it until December. I want to feel it in my hands and smell it, I love the smell of hobbit news.


Otaku-sempai
Immortal


Oct 26 2012, 2:05pm


Views: 411
The U.S. is usually 3 or 4 weeks behind in receiving U.K. magazines

We should be getting this issue of Empire in mid-to-late November.

'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring


marillaraina
Rohan

Oct 27 2012, 3:19am


Views: 388
Scans

Can someone PM me a link to the scans? I'd really like to read it but obviously don't want to cause whoever has them to get into trouble so a PM would be nice. :)

Thanks.