The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Dori, Ori and Nori



architecthis
Lorien

Jul 7 2011, 1:10pm


Views: 11464
Dori, Ori and Nori

http://www.comingsoon.net/news/movienews.php?id=79486


(This post was edited by Silverlode on Jul 7 2011, 7:07pm)


Voronwë_the_Faithful
Valinor

Jul 7 2011, 1:24pm


Views: 4465
Very interesting!

I'm not quite sure what to make of them, but thanks for posting that!

'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'

www.arda-reconstructed.com


Compa_Mighty
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 1:25pm


Views: 4605
The far left one looks strange... might be the hairdo...

But overall, I think this puts to rest the "miniaturized human" theory that circulated after the Empire and Entertainment Weekly pic. Overall, they look great.

By the way, you beat me to the story. Tongue

Oh, I have to ask here... all pics we've seen have very dark, very distinct edges... is it the way the production pics are being taken, or should we expect the movie to look like that. For example, in this particular one, the dark edges emphasizes the prosthetics... not complaining, just saying. Wink

Visit Mexico from A to Z! Index to the whole series here.
Essay winner of the Show us your Hobbit Pride Giveway!



Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 1:27pm


Views: 4188
!!

Wow! They all look great, I can see they are definitely going for a more diverse looking group of dwarves this time around! Shocked
Glad they're not going with the Gimli look for all 13 of them. Audience has to be able to distinguish between them.

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak

(This post was edited by Maiarmike on Jul 7 2011, 1:37pm)


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 1:27pm


Views: 4281
Now, that's interesting...

Well spotted!

So they are going for quite distinct looks and there is a colour difference there - Ori's red, it's too dark to tell with the others, on my screen at least. And they have got some of the angular dwarven styling in the costume to link to the previous films. And is it just me, or do they actually look dwarf proportion rather than human proportion?

Looks good, anyway - more please!

Do you think they're going for three at a time, then Thorin? Wink


architecthis
Lorien

Jul 7 2011, 1:34pm


Views: 4245
Agreed

They have a distinct look, and I think we should expect the movies too as well, much like the LOTR trilogy, but I don't think that will be a bad thing.

I think they look great! The more I look at the picture the more they sort of grow on me.


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 1:36pm


Views: 4339
They look OK

I definitely like the costumes, and I appreciate the efforts to make the three brothers look distinctive, but Nori's rocking one goofy hairstyle. I thought this was a Photoshop job for a moment. I'm also a bit troubled by their extremely short, goatee-like beards, which certainly aren't what I expect of Dwarves. The prosthetic noses and ears thankfully help to counter this. And is that the Book of Mazarbul in Ori's right hand...?


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 1:41pm


Views: 4262
Practicality, I assume.

I imagine it would be a nightmare to have to have these guys all sit in the chair for 5 hours every morning before shooting. They probably wanted something dwarven, but not too insane with the beards (except for Nori's crazy hair). Smile
Although I expect Gloin to probably look just as hairy as Gimli! Oh, and I think you might be right about the book in Ori's hand, nice catch! Those little details are always cool.

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak

(This post was edited by Maiarmike on Jul 7 2011, 1:44pm)


Compa_Mighty
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 1:49pm


Views: 4260
Well, they did offer the Glóin role to John Rhys Davies

So I think you're spot on... Glóin will look a lot like Gimli. Who else is from that family? Thorin and Balin, I think?

Visit Mexico from A to Z! Index to the whole series here.
Essay winner of the Show us your Hobbit Pride Giveway!



dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 1:50pm


Views: 4333
I don't think that's a hairstyle on Nori....

... I think maybe it's a hat? Or something he's carrying on his back - axes perhaps? I think the outline of his (more normal) hairdo is visible in front of the pointy shape.


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 1:53pm


Views: 4040
Bad hair day, Nori? Nah kidding, they look fantastic!

Their faces, costumes and weapons.... all perfect!

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster

(This post was edited by Faenoriel on Jul 7 2011, 1:54pm)


Silmaril
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 1:55pm


Views: 4001
hmmm...looks like action figures / puppets !?

strange. maybe it's the background, the light and situation that looks unreal.


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 1:58pm


Views: 3955
I think they've been manipulated a bit to give a short and stout look. Even their hands look fat and nubby.//

 

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 1:59pm


Views: 3990
A long beard is a pain when you need to fight, travel, work and do other Middle-Earthy stuff

Remember Gandalf was originally going to have a much longer beard, but they had to cut off a good deal of it. I can't remember whether it was because it was hard for Ian to move or act with it. Could have been both.

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster

(This post was edited by entmaiden on Jul 7 2011, 3:51pm)


kzer_za
Lorien

Jul 7 2011, 2:01pm


Views: 3979
The description of the brothers is my favorite part

"These three brothers, all sons of the same mother, could not be more different from each other. Dori, the oldest, spends much of his time watching out for Ori, the youngest; making sure he's not caught a chill or got himself killed by Wargs or Goblins. Nobody quite knows what Nori gets up to most of the time, except that it's guaranteed to be dodgy and quite probably, illegal. Dori, Nori and Ori are intensely loyal to each other – and whilst they are perfectly happy fighting amongst themselves, woe-betide any anyone who means harm to one of these brothers."

This sounds interesting. Seems like they're really trying to make the dwarves distinctive characters.


(This post was edited by kzer_za on Jul 7 2011, 2:02pm)


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 2:01pm


Views: 3852
Could be just the many layers of costume making it look like that//

 

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


Gandalf'sMother
Rohan

Jul 7 2011, 2:04pm


Views: 4014
Nori

Looks a tad silly, but overall, I'm pleased with the variety! Happy to see that they're not all fat Gimli-clones.


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 2:04pm


Views: 3863
Definitely.

I think in the book, they became one large mass of dwarves, and you don't hear from some of them much, besides Thorin and Balin. Then you have a only a few physical descriptions, like "the largest nose", or "the fattest dwarf". I imagine it was quite a challenge to give each of these dwarves a personality for the movies so they don't just fade into the background.

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 2:07pm


Views: 3944
Don't forget the description of their basic character traits!

These three brothers, all sons of the same mother, could not be more different from each other. Dori, the oldest, spends much of his time watching out for Ori, the youngest; making sure he's not caught a chill or got himself killed by Wargs or Goblins. Nobody quite knows what Nori gets up to most of the time, except that it's guaranteed to be dodgy and quite probably, illegal. Dori, Nori and Ori are intensely loyal to each other – and whilst they are perfectly happy fighting amongst themselves, woe-betide any anyone who means harm to one of these brothers.

I really like the sound of that. Can't wait to see them on silver screen. :)

How good they did the right thing and kept all the 13 Dwarves.





Hold on a second, they have the same mother? Does that mean to imply they don't have the same father?

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 2:08pm


Views: 3887
Ah, you beat me to it...

Yup, I love the description. They sound a loveable bunch.

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 2:11pm


Views: 3908
It may look wickedly awesome while he's in motion and seen from different angles.//

 

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


Mad Hatter of Middle-Earth
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 2:19pm


Views: 3811
Hmmmm

These dwarves are certainly not like Gimli but I'm confused over Dori's hair style! The costumes and swords look great! I think I like these dwarves!

All you have to decide is what to do with the time that has been given to you...


Otaku-sempai
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 2:21pm


Views: 3873
Ori is quite the fashion plate...

...as Dwarves go.


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 2:28pm


Views: 3814
Wonder how soon we can expect the rest of the group photos?

I'm dyin' to see the rest of the lot!
Edit: The hi-def photo on the front page of TORn is amazing, look at the detail! Does anyone else see the weapon that Nori has attached to his belt on the chain?

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak

(This post was edited by Maiarmike on Jul 7 2011, 2:33pm)


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 2:28pm


Views: 3787
Whoa...

I need time to let this soak in.

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.


Estel78
Tol Eressea

Jul 7 2011, 2:29pm


Views: 1936
They obviously made the picture look like a painting...

I like it! Very stylish.

As for the look of the dwarves, at first i was a little taken aback (i had different pictures in my mind) but the more i look at them the more i like them. Although, the beards really could have been slightly longer. Maybe it runs in the family. Wink


Hamfast
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 2:31pm


Views: 1883
very interesting indeed...

everything looks quite distinctive, and I love Nori's big club looking thingSmile


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 2:32pm


Views: 1967
I'm sure it's not just hair....

.... there's something behind his head - a hat, maybe, or something he's carrying on his back?




redgiraffe
Rohan

Jul 7 2011, 2:35pm


Views: 1927
I don't care if there is/isn't something behind his head

Yeah his hairstyle is a little "out there" but he sure does look Bad@$$ to me! And oh my Adam Brown... didn't know how he would turn out but he looks great!

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle


rings7
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 2:36pm


Views: 1856
That's one crazy hairdo

if it is indeed. Either way, they look great. Shorter hair than expected, but great. Smile


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 2:36pm


Views: 1809
Prosthetic fingers?

Cool. They are nubby, and/or mangled looking.

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.


Estel78
Tol Eressea

Jul 7 2011, 2:38pm


Views: 1865
I've noticed the chubby fingers as i looked at the HD picture i downloaded...

Must be prosthetics they wear on their fingers. Also, the way the costumes look makes them appear shorter.


Quote
I think they've been manipulated a bit to give a short and stout look. Even their hands look fat and nubby.



RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 2:39pm


Views: 1776
Hmm.

I guess I'll reserve judgement until I see the rest of them. Unimpressed



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


UltimateManGod
Registered User

Jul 7 2011, 2:42pm


Views: 1914
I don't think the beards are too short

At least for Dori and Nori the beards aren't too short. In the high res picture it looks like their beards are styled to fold up in on themselves, probably so they don't get in the way. And it then makes sense to have the youngest Ori have a short little beard. Did anyone else notice that Nori's eyebrows are weaved into his hear?


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 2:42pm


Views: 1875
It's definitely hair.

Take a look at the high-resolution photo on the main page.

http://www.theonering.net/...d-ori-in-the-hobbit/


Estel78
Tol Eressea

Jul 7 2011, 2:43pm


Views: 1884
Check out the high res picture, it's definitelly his hair. //

 


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 2:45pm


Views: 1735
I can't wait to see the rest!

I hope they show them all soon. I'm surprised PJ hasn't dropped these bombs on his facebook page. I do like these. I wasn't sure about Thorin at first, but after spending hours trying to blow up the Empire image, I've become quite fond of it now. His wig has grey mixed in, I'd bet my socks on it.

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.


Earl
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 2:48pm


Views: 1747
I too noticed that Adam Brown's hands are humongous :o) //

 



dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 2:50pm


Views: 1818
I have done, honest...

I can clearly see his hair in front and a three-point structure behind - something rigid with a symetrical shape and clear cut edges, not like hair at all.

Either I'm going bats - always a possibility - or he has something at the back of his head. Not complaining, just saying...

I think the designs and details look really good.


Earl
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 2:52pm


Views: 1896
Can you tell Ori's been hit by puberty?

Check those cute pimples on his face BlushSly



Eruonen
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 2:52pm


Views: 1819
They almost appear plasticized....ready for sale as sculptures or toys.

I think the look is fine; possibly a little too rich in clothing, but that does not bother me. The beards are held together with the various metal clips (whatever they are called). Unusual looking sword blade design.


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 2:52pm


Views: 1779
This may have been composited...

...from individual shots.

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.

(This post was edited by Pipe Dream on Jul 7 2011, 2:53pm)


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 2:54pm


Views: 1783
Yeah, you can see that Nori actually has the bottom portion of his beard tied up into a clip hanging below his chin.//

 

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


Mad Hatter of Middle-Earth
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 2:56pm


Views: 1758
I love the high res photo!

They sure are the stylin' dwarves!! Cool

All you have to decide is what to do with the time that has been given to you...


rings7
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 2:58pm


Views: 1721
I was gonna comment on that

but i thought they were freckles!


Oden
Rivendell


Jul 7 2011, 2:59pm


Views: 1741
Cloak & Hood

Love the cloak and hood design. Almost looks like the hood has an extended scarf attached. Can't really tell if it is separate or if the scarf is actually part of the hood and/or cloak. The two tassels - are those hanging from the hood or the scarf/cloak? Either way, love the design!

And the diversity...I am definitely anxious to see the remaining 10 dwarves up close and personal like these three.


kharank
Registered User

Jul 7 2011, 3:01pm


Views: 1732
In The Middle...

Is that Rodney Trotter in the middle? Tongue


Earl
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 3:02pm


Views: 1734
Does anyone notice that Nori's ears are almost outside his head?

As in, they look they're growing out of his hair. This is one goofy looking Dwarf, and yet he's growing on me already. I wonder if that's because I've been starved of Middle-earth so long Unimpressed



Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 3:08pm


Views: 1655
Aha!

I knew there was something suspiciously familiar about that Dwarf!


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 3:12pm


Views: 1730
He looks adorkable!

Makes me want to resort to using hearts and overload of smileys in my text... ugh. But there's something defintely little brothery about him. The costume is very well designed to give off the sense of fragility and youth, it's almost childlish. Also the haircut combined with the hood remind you of a Medieval monk, which together with the book and the overall expression give me a mental image of someone introvert and "nerdy". Now wasn't he the one with "fair hand writing" who often wrote in Elvish?

Just goes to show how much you can say or imply with the design before the character even opens his mouth.

*gets ready to bawl her eyes out every time she watches the Mazarbul scene again in LotR*

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


micha84
Rivendell

Jul 7 2011, 3:13pm


Views: 1650
clever move!

i'm sure peter & co. are worried about the norioridoribalindwalinfilikili mess of names... most people will be confused by the similarities. so they deliberately present you groups of dwarves with similar names and let those images and names sink in before th next batch comes. fili and kili next?

overall a clever move to give people time to sort out the name issue. it'll still be one big mess for most moviegoers, I assume. not everyone watches out for these promo images...


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 3:14pm


Views: 1679
Exactly! They're gonna make us all cry at that scene in the future!

WETA is so good at distinguishing characters based on their personalities. You can tell Dori is the experienced, hardened one, and Nori is the slightly unhinged, possibly crazy one. Ori is the innocent, maybe even scholarly one.

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 3:16pm


Views: 1673
"I comb my hair & beard to make my face look like a star. 'Cause I'm awesome like that."

I like his attitude. The more I look at them, the more I love them all.

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


Earl
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 3:20pm


Views: 1583
LOL... adorkable is the word alright

I didn't make the connection between the book in his hand and the fact that he was the scribe. That is such amazing detail Cool



SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 3:27pm


Views: 1519
Egads man, you're insatiable! //

Laugh


namarie
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 3:27pm


Views: 1578
yay..we finnally see

Mark Hadlow's face as Dori, Adam Brown is kinda cute as Ori and poor Jed Brophy is unrecognizable againSmile

And is that pointy thing on his head his hair?!

Shocked





There is always hope

(This post was edited by namarie on Jul 7 2011, 3:29pm)


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 3:29pm


Views: 1537
Oh I know, I'm too excited for my own good!

Angelic

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


namarie
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 3:30pm


Views: 1560
yeah, he kinda reminds me of

a monk too :)

Is that the Bible under his arm?Tongue


There is always hope


eralkfang
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 3:32pm


Views: 1612
Dodgy Dwarves?

Be still my fannish heart! I think I'm going to like Nori, whom I think we should all nickname Starfish immediately.

They look great and most importantly, they look dwarvish. A little hipper than Gimli, to be sure, but they look fantastic, distinctly dwarven, and distinct from each other. Nori and Ori look more like siblings, and I love the prosthetics for Dori. Seriously, I'm overjoyed to see photos of the dwarves so soon and can't wait to see the other ten.

While they certainly do have shorter beards, they're actually probably a big longer than we actually think—the boys have their beards and their hair braided in remarkably complex ways. Nori's is particularly ridiculous. I imagine if they unbraided them they'd have beard and hair lengths closer to what we usually think of for dwarves. They're men—er, dwarves—of the road; gotta keep the loose hair out of the way!


sushiking
The Shire


Jul 7 2011, 3:32pm


Views: 1764
Looks a tad cartoony?

But still a wonderful picture! Can't wait to see the rest!!!!!

<3


Elfhelm
The Shire

Jul 7 2011, 3:34pm


Views: 1526
Very nice!

The costumes look terrific and I really like their overall look, also very well done on making each one easily distinguishable. Interesting angular design on the shortsword too, seems very dwarvish to me. Although I don't really know what to make of the weird, umm... starfish =) hairdo... it really must be all hair, if you look at the braid going up from his forehead. Also, it's good to see them giving different weapons to the dwarves to further distinguish them from each other, with such a wicked looking spiked top that is no mere walking staff!


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 3:35pm


Views: 1595
You may have something there.

This is quick and dirty, but you can see where Jed's real ears are located in relation to the make-up.
http://i176.photobucket.com/...jones-indiana/JB.gif

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 3:35pm


Views: 1552
The similar names mean the charatcers are related

Fili & Kili = brothers
Nori, Dori & Ori = brothers
etc

This isn't necessarily a bad thing. In the contradiction. In a cast like this, sub-grouping the Dwarves into separate units which all have their inner dynamics helps to characterize them all and make them easier for the audience to handle and relate to. And each of the sub-groups having their "theme naming" just makes it easier to place each Dwarf into his own group.

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 3:36pm


Views: 1513
Whoa, very nice!//

 

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 3:39pm


Views: 1496
Great work!

They probably had to give him artifical ears, beacuse his real ears are buried under his wig.

Now the question is, does he hear anything? XD

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


namarie
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 3:43pm


Views: 1541
It's kind of crazy how they

braid his eyebrows into his hair Laugh


There is always hope


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 3:43pm


Views: 1491
From now on, Nori shall be known as Starfish.

I like it. ;D And the bizarre hair certainly makes him look "mad, bad and dangerous to know". Well, at least mad. In a good way.

Plus, I think we should have buried Tolkien in a larger coffin, he probably cant turn very well in his. -Rossmonster


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 3:45pm


Views: 1457
Probably so.

Maybe too good? Now that I think about it, I should stop doing stuff like that. I don't want to ruin the illusion for everyone, especially myself.

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.


Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 3:48pm


Views: 1474
I still want more color

But for now I'll just be over here wondering how much longer it will take fans to decipher that delicious cowl & hood so I can knit one for myself! Cool Is that a liripipe I see poking out of the back of it? And knitted mitts like Gandalf's!

My LiveJournal
My Costuming Site
TORn's Costume Discussions Archive


Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 3:49pm


Views: 1481
It looks like hair to me

With some sort of support/structure underneath. But only time (and more pictures) will tell of for sure.

My LiveJournal
My Costuming Site
TORn's Costume Discussions Archive


chrismortega
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 3:51pm


Views: 1636
Re: Cartoony

I agree, and I can't help but wonder if that's some of Guillermo's design aesthetic. One of the things I've always hated about Guillermo's work (sorry, I'm a Guillermo hater) is his goofy looking characters. However, I can see myself falling in love with this look regardless. I'm just too much of a LOTR nerd not to.

So glad to finally meet some of the dwarvs, KEEP 'EM COMING!

"NEVER TRUST AN ELF!"


sushiking
The Shire


Jul 7 2011, 3:53pm


Views: 1489
Oo and may i point out-

Why on the bottom of there capes/robes so dirty? Is it to show the dirt of how far they travel or blood of goblins/orcs?


Bullroarer
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 3:54pm


Views: 1556
My opinion on Dori, Ori and Nori!

Omg. this looks so cool, the armour and wep design is awsome, my only problem is that their beards are to small! I was expecting something more like gimli's beard or the original description in the book ( you know, big beard stucked underneath their belts).Ah well, it still does not change that fact that I think they look really cool and I love the dwarf rockin the spick mohawk thing.

All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us- Gandalf to Frodo


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 3:58pm


Views: 1693
I think they will unveil them in clusters.

Picture #1: Nori, Dori and Ori.
Picture #2: Bifur, Bofur and Bombur.
Picture #3: Oin and Gloin.
Picture #4: Fili and Kili.
Picture #5: Balin and Dwalin
Picture #6: Thorin Oakenshield.

Or something along those lines. I think they're going to be revealed in ascending order of importance, arranged in familial clusters. The result would be quite clumsy if they stuck to a rigid 'three at a time' structure; they'd have to mix up the brothers in various ways (Oin and Gloin with Balin? Fili and Kili with Dwalin?), and the descriptions that come with the pictures would confuse readers with references to the brothers in the other pictures. It would not surprise me if they put Fili, Kili and Thorin in one picture (the last one) for the same reasons.


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 4:00pm


Views: 1377
Maybe they incorporated the ears onto the wigs where possible.

It would certainly save time.

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 4:06pm


Views: 1724
Just out of curiosity

Which of GDT's characters do these Dwarves remind you of? His humans tend to look human and his monsters tend to look monstrous, but Nori, Dori and Ori seem to occupy a middle ground that we don't really see in GDT's work.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 4:09pm


Views: 1689
Please do not start this up again.

Can't we get through one thread without someone taking an unnecessary swing at Guillermo?

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 4:13pm


Views: 1658
Unnecessary?

Everyone is entitled to express their opinion. It's not a personal attack.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


sushiking
The Shire


Jul 7 2011, 4:14pm


Views: 1554
No one is taking swings at anyone :P

He's just not a fan on Guillermo, im sure he's not hating anything just saying.



Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 4:16pm


Views: 1607
Of course it is personal

And the side bar was just mean spirited entitled or not.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 4:18pm


Views: 1607
'I'm a Guillermo hater' is a bit on the personal side.

This sort of stuff is the reason he left the board.


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 4:19pm


Views: 1552
Nonsense.

He stated that he didn't like GDT's characters. He made no comment at all about GDT as a person.

If no one is allowed to express negative opinions, TORn might as well close up shop.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 4:20pm


Views: 1536
Actually, that one seems pretty fair to me

I've always liked GDT's character designs, but they're obviously not to everyone's tastes. I don't see where that's a swipe against GDT so much as a statement that GDT's characters weren't to his preferences.

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dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 4:20pm


Views: 1661
Yes, I wasn't meaning necessarily in threes....

... that was just an example (my teeny brain finds 'three into twelve goes four' quite manageable as an idea!) Just in groups, with Thorin at the end. I reckon he'll come last.


sushiking
The Shire


Jul 7 2011, 4:20pm


Views: 1512
I'm a Guillermo fan...

I enjoy his work, but there's no way that I'm offended by it, it's just his opinion the way i see it. XD


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 4:21pm


Views: 1531
I hope GDT has a thicker skin than that.

Especially when it's plainly obvious that by "Guillermo hater," the poster clearly means Guillermo's work, and not the man himself.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


oilfan94
Registered User

Jul 7 2011, 4:23pm


Views: 1501
Hair issue

I love everything, except maybe the starfish hair-do...but I'd suggest that we shouldn't get too excited about that just yet.

It looks clear to me that there was some Photoshop'ery done....and more than just the usual adjustments of the photo(s). Look at the highlights running up his right side (our left). That shows me that there was an accent/kicker light on that side...but the highlight is missing from the top point of the hair. According to the lighting on the rest of him, that point should have a highlight on that side and creating a rim around the edge...but it doesn't. This tells me that something was added or removed....and I'd guess that something was removed, or probably covered over with hair (digitally).

I love it when being a photographer and Tolkien geek come together :D


Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 4:26pm


Views: 1487
The Dwarves are looking great...

Wow! More terrific work from WETA here, particularly Dori, who has a pretty cool and iconic-looking costume. The placement of the weapon on his belt is just a wee bit unfortunate, however...

And is that the Book of Marzabul I see in Ori's hand? Nice to see they're already setting up the character's tries to LotR...Smile

I would rather be watching Peter Jackson's "The Hobbit" and Ridley Scott's "Prometheus"...it's going to be a long few years.


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 4:27pm


Views: 1529
Do you know this for sure, Flagg?

Because if you don't, I don't think you should post it as if it were fact. The impression I had was that Guillermo left the board because he left the film and was moving on to other projects - and at the time we were generally sorry to see him go and sent him a lot of very nice messages of thanks and support.

Personally I would think it unlikely that he would have continued to post here when he wasn't directing the film, but of course I don't know that for a fact because I don't know him.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 4:34pm


Views: 1518
Do you really want this thread to digress to the PJ versus GdT mayhem

that has been with us lately. I happen to believe an artists work is part of them so criticism, though not intended as personal can certainly be taken that way. Now back to the point. We have no Idea who designed the Dwarves look. I am sure it was a team effort. Nuf said.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
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chrismortega
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 4:35pm


Views: 1517
Not trying to take any swings...

Whoa, I'm hardly picking on Guillermo, just making a relevant observation that happens to be unfavorable. If you disagree I don't mind arguing, but please don't come at me like I've done something wrong. There should be room for differing opinions.

What I'm referring to is a stylistic resemblance. His characters (non-human) tend to be a bit bright, cartoonish, and even gaudy for my tastes. Look at all the characters in Hellboy and Pan's Labyrinth for examples of what I'm talking about. I personally think this clashes with the style set forth Peter's Lord of the Rings trilogy, which to me was more gritty and nuanced.

I'm brining Guillermo in to this because I think it's likely that these designs were generated while he was still heading up the project. Take for example these hairstyles in comparison to those of the dwarves in LOTR. It just seems to fit his style more than Peters. I realize of course that The Hobbit is a children's book, and Peter may choose to make this movie in a way that reflects that. But my personal desire is to see something that more closely matches the Middle Earth I've grown to love in LOTR.

"NEVER TRUST AN ELF!"


Earl
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 4:39pm


Views: 1436
That's incredible!

It sure does seem to prove that Jed's been buried under an awful lot of prosthetics. Thanks Pipe Dream Smile



chrismortega
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 4:41pm


Views: 1436
Guillermo hater... meant that more in a joking way

I have a great respect for the guy. This is one of the pitfalls of communicating via text. Let me clarify: I think he's great, but I was glad to see Peter take over the director's chair.

G, if you read this (which you probably won't) we all love you, including me!

"NEVER TRUST AN ELF!"


DanielLB
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 4:42pm


Views: 1443
Dori

Have quickly read all the comments, but didn;t see anything.

Has anyone noticed that Dori's eyebrows are platted! Brilliant!


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 4:43pm


Views: 1485
Peter Jackson never entered into this conversation until just now, when you brought it up.

And nobody is trying to making this anyone vs. anyone.

I'm simply defending chrismortega's right to express an opinion that may differ with other people's opinions.

That's all.

Nuf said.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 4:44pm


Views: 1407
Yes

He has said that part of the reason he no longer posts here is that the tone of discussion has changed, and I am quite sure that he was referring to the growing negativity here towards him and his work, as exemplified by the 'Del Toro's Smaug' thread. I really can't imagine any other tonal shift he might have been talking about.


Morok Cloudkeeper
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 4:45pm


Views: 1434
Amazing!

They all look amazing.Their costumes are great,weapons too,but what's up with Nori's hair?

Power can be held in the smallest of things...



(This post was edited by Legos on Jul 7 2011, 4:46pm)


thesithempire
Rivendell

Jul 7 2011, 4:48pm


Views: 1377
Wow

To me, these Dwarves are just perfect. Designing 13 distinctive dwarves is a huge undertaking, and it's clear to me based on this picture (and the glimpse we got in the background image of the Bilbo pic) that PJ, Weta and company really managed to overcome this hurdle.

As some of you know, I'm distinctly displeased with the way TTT and ROTK came out (and, conversely, just as enamored by FOTR), which I think should be entirely re-cut from scratch. But, for some reason, I've been having nothing but positive feelings about The Hobbit, and everything I continue to see and read confirms that feeling even stronger.

The costumes, the hairstyles, the weapons (or accoutrements), the way the actors seem to embody their roles; it's all perfect; and I can't wait to see them come to life on the screen.

I'm also happy with the way PJ is doling out significant images and tidbits of info along the way to build excitement. Big difference from the shabby way the Lucas corporation deals with its fans.


sushiking
The Shire


Jul 7 2011, 4:48pm


Views: 1436
WHat?

How do you know PJ even entered this conversation?


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 4:49pm


Views: 1390
No worries

There *is* room for differing opinions and your original post was fine.

Some people here are overly sensitive about Gullermo and some are overly sensitive about PJ. Both need take a deep breath and count to 10 when someone is critical of those directors and their works without becoming personally insulting. It's okay to post here and not like either! Above all everyone should make sure they're not holding others here to some kind of double standard that they're not willing to adhere to themselves.


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase



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SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 4:49pm


Views: 1368
In this case I think it's a question of relevance.

Unless of course it is now common knowledge that GDT is responsible for the designs "we" don't like and PJ is responsible for the ones "we" do.

Here is the bit that re-sparked this tiresome debate:

Quote

I can't help but wonder if that's some of Guillermo's design aesthetic. One of the things I've always hated about Guillermo's work (sorry, I'm a Guillermo hater) is his goofy looking characters.



The question is, why bring GDT into this at all? Chris has been around long enough to know that that is button best not pushed.

My own view is that if this keeps up, all we will have managed to do is to put the mods in a very awkward position...



RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 4:52pm


Views: 1413
???

I never claimed that PJ himself was contributing to the discussion.

I mean only that nobody mentioned him until Kangi Ska brought him up.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 4:53pm


Views: 1374
Speculation?

Is that allowed?

I'm not sure why I'm even pursuing this. To the best of my knowledge, I've never seen any of GDT's movies, so I don't know if I like his work or not. I just don't want to see people getting suppressed just because other people may not care for their points of view.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 4:57pm


Views: 1371
All Kangi did was say he didn't want 'GDT vs PJ' to be brought up

Of course there's a certain irony in saying something shouldn't be brought up (which means you have to bring it up), but I think he was attempting to avoid an argument rather than start one.


Not_the_beard
The Shire

Jul 7 2011, 4:59pm


Views: 1396
Uniqueness is going to really help

I can imagine the difference between Bilbo welcoming in 13 Gimlis to his house as compared to welcoming in 13 distinct and very different characters. If they were all the same, it might be easier for him to not be as overwhelmed. He might reason that since they all look the same, he can deal with them as if they all are the same. But this way, where the audience and Bilbo can experience that each character is unique, with a very different personality, the awe, confusion, and overwhelming nature of their visit can be much more punctuated. The distinctness is going to help put the audience in Bilbo's shoes.

As for the photo itself, I was put off a little at first, thought it was a little cartoony, but it's been growing on me. The detail is astounding and realizing that these characters will be moving around in a vibrant world gets me all the more excited.


chrismortega
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 5:01pm


Views: 1347
Jeez it was just an observation

Forget I said anything at all. I'd rather everyone get along on here than be right.

On another note, Nori's crazy hairstyle gives some weight to the Mohawk theory from a while back. One of the dwarves leaning over the table in the bag-end shot kind of looks like he has a Mohawk, and maybe some tattoos on his head if you ask me.

"NEVER TRUST AN ELF!"


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 5:02pm


Views: 1368
Further OT: It is true, he said that

Unsure

but he didn't say exactly what he meant by "tone." It seemed to me that it was the bickering on Hobbit in general, most notably around the question of 3D -- at least gauging by the timing of the remark. Besides, lingering after the decision he made could not have been easy... it was a testiment to how fond he was of our community that he hung around at all after saying his good-byes.


redgiraffe
Rohan

Jul 7 2011, 5:02pm


Views: 1403
Irony in this thread

In an attempt to prevent a GDT/PJ discussion... a GDT/PJ discussion was actually created.

Maybe if we all just act like big boys and girls and not try to get our two cents in about the GDT/PJ bit and just leave it be and get back to discussing the pic then we won't have to worry about going off topic

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle

(This post was edited by redgiraffe on Jul 7 2011, 5:07pm)


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 5:05pm


Views: 1381
Exactly!


Quote
Of course there's a certain irony in saying something shouldn't be brought up (which means you have to bring it up), but I think he was attempting to avoid an argument rather than start one.


The only person who came close to starting it up again is Kangi, lol. Laugh

I think it's time for everyone to take off any hypersensitive GDT or PJ chips they may have on their shoulder and move on. People are always going to like and/or dislike *something* about them. And, as long as they're not insulting them personally in a way that's against the rules here, they're not only free to express their views, they're encouraged to.



Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase



TORn Calendar


Mythopoeia
Bree

Jul 7 2011, 5:09pm


Views: 1360
I really like the scholarly look Ori has

as it works well with what little we know of him. He's almost got a monkish look, which is interesting. Nori's hair totally threw me at first, but I'm actually liking it now--I'll be interested to see what's holding it in that funky shape, as I'm assuming there's no such thing as hair-gel in Middle-earth . . . Overall I'm loving the looks, especially the clothing! And braided beards are fine; braids significantly shorten hair-length but are also practical. The photos look a bit too photoshopped, though. When I first saw the picture I thought it was just computer graphic concept art!


DanielLB
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 5:11pm


Views: 1294
I meant Nori

Blimey. Getting confused already!


redgiraffe
Rohan

Jul 7 2011, 5:15pm


Views: 1299
Anyone else thought Nori had a huge lower lip?

When looking at the original picture it looked like Nori had a huge lower lip and that made me think he was a little cartoonish looking. But if you look at the hi-res pic it's clearly his beard over his chin that is being lit up by the light. I found that funny.

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle


chrismortega
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 5:17pm


Views: 1342
Computer Graphic Concept Art

Everyone I showed this to said the same thing... "Is this... real, or is it like CG of what they think it's going to look like?" Which was strange to me, but given the weird filters or whatever they are using on the pics I guess I can understand.

"It was deliberate, it was deliberate..."

(This post was edited by chrismortega on Jul 7 2011, 5:17pm)


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 5:19pm


Views: 1294
That's fair Rosie, but

as others have noted from time to time (Darkstone did today in fact), one of the things that keeps this community working is our sensitivity to each other's sensibilities. And there are some topics, as you know, that are taboo simply because of what they almost always devolve into.

The core idea could just as easily (and harmlessly) been expressed this way: "I can't help but wonder if that's some of Guillermo's design aesthetic."

The sentence that followed that was not speculation, not particularly relevant to the discussion, and would reasonably be expected to provoke a reaction -- hence the (sorry, I'm a Guillermo hater) qualification.

On a side note, if you (and by you I mean anyone reading) knew that the way you (personally) spoke to some people was the reason someone else left TORn, would that be okay with you?




Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 5:19pm


Views: 1273
I understand what you are saying

You may not realise that the non-human characters in Pan's Labyrinth were meant to resemble the figments of a child's imagination, whereas Hellboy is a colourful and vibrant comic-book adaptation. GDT has shown himself capable of making 'gritty' films with Mimic and The Devil's Backbone, which have only minimal visual fantasy elements. My point is that I do not recognise any of GDT's design hallmarks in these Dwarves. The human characters in every single one of his films look human, and even his borderline-human characters (like Nomak in Blade II and Rasputin in Hellboy) still look very human-like. Giant star-shaped haircuts are not really his style. Maybe I'm wrong and GDT designed the Dwarves after all; PJ mentioned in the Empire interview that he kept his distance and allowed GDT to handle the development of the Dwarves into distinct characters (a task PJ found intimidating), so maybe he came up with the designs as well as the confabulatory characteristics. I don't really mind who was responsible; I think Dori looks great, Ori looks good, and now that I think about it, Nori's ridiculous look may well pay off when it comes to maintaining the book's humorous tone.


rings7
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 5:20pm


Views: 1289
I knew the thread would immediately

turn into a PJ-GDT discussion. But i was wrong. It took what...4 pages? Wink

It takes only one dude to even the name and voila.


Earl
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 5:23pm


Views: 1276
Yup! I zoomed all the way in and saw the same thing...

... Nori looked a little goofy from afar (in this pic) because of those lips, but from close quarters, I realized that wasn't his lip and that he actually looks pretty gruff and grumpy.



Earl
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 5:25pm


Views: 1289
Yes, all the pictures till date look like HDR photos

Examples of HDR photography can be seen here. I'm sure you know that though (as you said you're knowledgeable about photography) WinkCool



SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 5:26pm


Views: 1284
And I too made an observation...

That aside, I'm intrigued by the tattoo idea. I wonder if dwarfs would ever shave their heads? For some reason it seems a cultural trait not to do so. Would that make him iconoclastic?

For what it's worth, I agree that the publicity still looks a tidge cartoony. To my eye it appears slightly CGI'd -- at first glance my fears that the dwarfs were going to be all CGI save their faces came rushing back. (Can't remember which one of the dwarfs said they only need their faces, it was last year around the time we first met the cast.)


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 5:27pm


Views: 1269
Express away

I just know...

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 5:29pm


Views: 1216
Thank youuvery much.//

 

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Patty
Immortal


Jul 7 2011, 5:32pm


Views: 1267
Overall, I'm very pleased with this...

They look enough like Gimli to be recognizable as his race of beings but distinct, with an identity of their own. I like the hairstyles, too--distinguished, and over the top enough to be the elite of the dwarves, even if the race of men would find them a little funny. Good job.

Permanent address: Into the West





Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 5:34pm


Views: 1254
Strangely enough, my first reaction was the opposite

I thought they didn't look cartooney enough! But then again, I'm still holding out for bright yellow stockings and sky blue hoods. Now that I've had some time with the picture to let it sink in, I think I can see what chris means by cartooney, but I'm not sure it's a bad thing for me.

Now that we've had pictures, I want to see these guys in action! How does the saying go? If you give a fan a photo...?

My LiveJournal
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TORn's Costume Discussions Archive


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 5:45pm


Views: 1239
It is a big sandbox. We can all learn to play together.

Sir D has the right idea.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Snaga
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 5:51pm


Views: 1243
I approve of the variety

I'm glad they're not just a bunch of Gimli clones. If you look around in real life you'll see tremendous variation in real people, and I see no reason why dwarves should be any different. After all we're only going to get at most six hours (and certainly less screen time than that dealing with the dwarves) to get to know these gentlemen. IMO having each of them being distinguished from the others can only make the creative team's job easier in this respect.


redgiraffe
Rohan

Jul 7 2011, 5:56pm


Views: 1433
The only one that should look somewhat like Gimli is Gloin

And of course I hope that when they show the dwarven army some of them have the full face prosthetics like Gimli (but still look different), though I don't want all of them to have face prosthetics. But the main 13 should all look different, and really Gloin doesn't have to look that much like Gimli anyway.

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle


Eowyn of Penns Woods
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 5:58pm


Views: 1434
Looks like hat hair to me...


pentagon hat hair! ;)


**********************************

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NABOUF
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NARF: NWtS Chapter Member since June 17,2011


Patty
Immortal


Jul 7 2011, 5:58pm


Views: 1376
Another fantastic nick! Welcome to TORn, Not_the_beard! /

 

Permanent address: Into the West





Patty
Immortal


Jul 7 2011, 6:04pm


Views: 1406
"If you give a fan a photo"

Just so, Arwen's daughter!Wink

Permanent address: Into the West





Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 6:06pm


Views: 1435
Maybe he's been wearing something like this...

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/..._with_a_Squirrel.jpg

Cool

My LiveJournal
My Costuming Site
TORn's Costume Discussions Archive


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 6:18pm


Views: 1440
That is all kinds of strange

the inference I mean Laugh. Still I kind of like it. Reminds me too of this:

But (thankfully) not this:




dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 6:26pm


Views: 1335
Thanks for the laugh, SirDennis...

... but if they want a hat for a spider, that might just do!


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 6:32pm


Views: 1306
Well, I'm coming at this from...

...the point of view of someone who left TORn for a while myself, back in the LOTR days, when it was made very clear to me that my (sometimes negative) opinions on PJ's films were not welcome here.

I always try to be careful with my words, and not say things that can be misconstrued. But I think it's also incumbent on other people to learn to be more tolerant of different points of view and not take every disagreement as a personal affront.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 6:33pm


Views: 1310
Thanks Earl

I've been wondering about this. They kind of remind me of infra-red photos, except in colour. The digital enhancement is obvious (leading to Chris's observation that they appear similar to CGI) but not unpleasant... sort of "painterly."

A similar, but not quite as striking or rich, effect can be created by fiddling with the saturation of an image. Using that technique though depends a great deal on the "density" (or whatever it's called now) of the original jpeg.


Eowyn of Penns Woods
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 6:37pm


Views: 1406
Oh, but can't you just picture Bilbo...


and his black emperors! =)

**********************************

NARF
NABOUF
Not a TORns*b!
Certified Curmudgeon
Knitting Knerd
NARF: NWtS Chapter Member since June 17,2011


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 6:47pm


Views: 1346
Dwarves in fascinators...

Hmm...that's *really* not an image I ever pictured reading the book. Laugh



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


Rufus
Bree

Jul 7 2011, 7:00pm


Views: 1282
brilliant

I really like them. I'm glad that they do not look aloke and not at all cartoonish


nobofthepony
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 7:04pm


Views: 1252
you're fine...

It's just that it's a sensitive subject, but we're going to have to get used to it coming up.

For what it's worth, I think these Dwarves do look like GDT had a hand in their creation and they look great.

Especially the one in the middle...he looks like an interesting character...a dwarf unlike any we've "seen" yet.


Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 7:15pm


Views: 1291
Natural facelift? Middle-earth botox? ;-) //


In Reply To
It's kind of crazy how they braid his eyebrows into his hair


Silverlode

"Of all faces those of our familiares are the ones both most difficult to play fantastic tricks with, and most difficult really to see with fresh attention. They have become like the things which once attracted us by their glitter, or their colour, or their shape, and we laid hands on them, and then locked them in our hoard, acquired them, and acquiring ceased to look at them.
Creative fantasy, because it is mainly trying to do something else [make something new], may open your hoard and let all the locked things fly away like cage-birds. The gems all turn into flowers or flames, and you will be warned that all you had (or knew) was dangerous and potent, not really effectively chained, free and wild; no more yours than they were you."
-On Fairy Stories


DrDeath153
Lorien

Jul 7 2011, 7:17pm


Views: 1359
Oh dear, i think i'm going to be Mr Malcontent again

I'm sorry about this, i really am, but as someone who actually thought they got the dwarves right in the lotr films, this picture is a wonderful surprise but not a wholly pleasant one. On the plus side, the costumes are fantastic. Dori is the most Gimli-esque and i do feel very comfortable with his look, but Nori and Ori's costumes are equally fine examples of work, less overtly dwarven in their colour and geometry but nevertheless fine in their own merit. However, in the picture we see, albeit highly stylised and coloured, the problem with dwarven proportions really does show it's too human head. The way they fill their costumes and the size of my head confirms (now beyond almost any doubt) that they have abandoned the proportions they utilised with Gimli- the heads don't fit 'blockishly' on the shoulders and the prosthetic transformation i was hoping for simply hasn't taken place. Lets talk about them separately though:

Dori: Like i said before, his is the most recognisably Gimli-esque costume and i really do adore it, it's got the rich earthy shades they identified with the dwarves before, it's full of strong, distinctive lines including the kind of 'mantle' along with that gorgeous short sleeved burgandy overcoat. There's some fantastic details like the vambraces and the thick angular scabbard for that short dwarven falchion he's carrying. The chains hanging from his belt also give that heavy feeling and the tilt of the belt buckle gives away a nicely sprawling gut. The beard isn't as long as i glimpsed it in the film- there was another big bulk of it under the tube binding it, but i suppose i saw it wrong. Interesting decision to keep the space under his nose free of 'tache and instead having it coming out from behind his nostrils. If the head was broadened and lowered i would be perfectly fine with this version of Dori.

Nori: Seems to be the 'druid' referred to in the empire report. A case not exactly saved with the long staff-like mace. You can definately tell it's Jed Brophy under there, well, of the actors cast. I'm really not a fan of the starfish hairstyle to be honest- i think it's a bit 'out there' to look like something a dwarf, quite a proud and humourless race, would sport. The narrowness of his face (only accentuated by the nose and the sweeping woven eyebrows robs the essential dwarvishness for me and although the costuming isn't bad, the colouration and cuts aren't strong enough and the body not broad enough to sell me as him belonging to that race. He looks a bit what he is- a skinny guy in an oversized costume.

Ori: Well i've always had a theory that Ori's authorship of the Book of Mazarbul would be played up into making him the official 'nerd' of the group and it seems i was right (first time for everythingLaugh). While the book he's clutching looks significantly too small to be the same book, it nevertheless reflects his either day job, or personal inclinations. The costume reminds me very much (without even seeing the film all through) of David Wenhams from Van Helsing and as others have said, plays up his youthfulness along with the 'mum's knitting' scarf, and pudding basin haircut. The idea behind the beard is pretty sound (minimal 'tache, Joshamee Gibbs style sideburns/beard) but the resemblance to Nicholas Lyndhurst is very prominent and i'm not sure if that's what i want from a dwarf. Again, the balance of facial proportions puts me off.

So yeah, i've got to be honest, i really am not wholly impressed. There's some fantastic ideas in there, but because of the problems in proportions they ultimately just look like men in silly costumes rather than dwarves in dwarven gear.

Dr Death


LittleTook
The Shire


Jul 7 2011, 7:31pm


Views: 1259
Nori's Braided Brows

Haha! I was wondering if it was just me who thought it looked like that or if his eyebrows really were braided into his, erm, hair(?)!

I'm in the same boat as most people-- at first glance the picture seems strange (what with the "Gimli Dwarf" image in our minds and all), but the more one looks at it and notices the details... I love it and am already champing at the bit to see more! Laugh

* * *

"Faithless is he who says farewell when the road darkens." ~Gimli

"Despair is only for those who see the end beyond all doubt. We do not." ~ Gandalf


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 7:32pm


Views: 1269
The question it raises

is whose job is it to do all that braiding in the first place? Surely dwarf fingers are far too work worn for such intricate weaves?


(This post was edited by SirDennisC on Jul 7 2011, 7:33pm)


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 7:41pm


Views: 1255
That's funny, because...

... I think their body proportion in that photographs is more dwarf than man and I've been wondering how they managed it. They don't have the broad-headed look Gimli had, (I think a lot of that was achieved with his hair), but it you look at the proportion of their figures... Classically an adult man's head is one-eighth of his full height - or, put another way, body is about 7 head lengths. On this photo Dori's is five head lengths and the others look about the same. Don't understand it but it seems to me that's how it is.

Another thought, just at random. They have splattered a bit of dirt on the costumes but I wonder how these very precise hairstyles will stand up to life on the road, and what they'll look like when they get a bit scruffier.


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 7:46pm


Views: 1196
Ah ha!

The braided eyebrows tie into and create the head hair shaping along with the one that goes over the top. I'd bet there are braids on the back of his head as well. I was trying to figure out how they could achieve that effect without sticking a form onto his head. To answer your question, maybe Dwarf women have smaller fingers?

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.

(This post was edited by Pipe Dream on Jul 7 2011, 7:50pm)


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 7:46pm


Views: 1170
Interesting that you can be so sure

that's what he meant, or that you can be so sure he really doesn't frequent the boards any longer. Wink


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase



TORn Calendar


DrDeath153
Lorien

Jul 7 2011, 7:47pm


Views: 1235
It is the broadness rather than the height of the heads i was referring to

And i'm not convinced Gimli's broadness was wholly about hair, hair of course played a part, particularly in hiding the neck and getting that kind of 'brick on a cinder-block' look to his head and shoulders, but the breadth of the head generally was just as prominent. It was either perfectly round with the hair creating the lateral proportion or it was slightly lateral itself.

Dr Death


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Jul 7 2011, 7:49pm


Views: 1195
They could be scale doubles...

...with head replacement shots to make them look shorter.

"There is a long road yet," said Gandalf. "But it is the last road," said Bilbo.


maut
Rivendell


Jul 7 2011, 7:50pm


Views: 1179
Wow!

They look a lot different from what I've ever imagined.
But I like them. But Nory looks really strange....Well, I think I can live with it.
And I like description as well.

Far over the misty mountains cold

To dungeons deep and caverns old

We must away ere break of day

To seek the pale enchanted gold.
__________________________________
...and the sound of the kettle on his hearth was ever after more musical than it had been even in the quiet days before the Unexpected Party

________________________________
Welcome back to Middle-Earth!!!


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 7 2011, 7:51pm


Views: 1173
He said he didn't come here much any more

In the same sentence where he said that the tone had changed. I don't have the privilege of telling when he's on TORn, so I took his word for it.


bookgirl13
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 8:03pm


Views: 1229
Dwarves proud and humourless?


Quote
I'm really not a fan of the starfish hairstyle to be honest- i think it's a bit 'out there' to look like something a dwarf, quite a proud and humourless race, would sport.

There has already been quite a bit information that the dwarves are not going to be humourless in this film. The book itself is more comedic in tone to the LotR, much of it stemming from the antics of the dwarves. The quote in the Empire article reminds me of the attitude of Richard Wilson as Victor Meldrew in One Foot in the Grave. Also Gimli was, at times, played for laughs - running in Rohan; too short to see over the battlements at Helm's Deep; counting victims at the Battle of Pelennior Fields; greeting the hobbits at the entrance to Isengard. As well as the infamous drinking game with Legolas. I get the impression that Thorin is going to played more seriously but he was more pompous in the book.


Darkstone
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 8:09pm


Views: 1279
Fantastic!!

Nori and Dori seem to have most of their beards stuffed down the front of their clothing.

Anyway, who says Dwarves have long beards? Only Dwalin:

“It was a dwarf with a blue beard tucked into a golden belt, and very bright eyes under his dark-green hood. As soon a the door was opened, he pushed inside, just as if he had been expected. He hung his hooded cloak on the nearest peg, and ‘Dwalin at your service!’ he said with a low bow.”

and Gandalf:

“He had a tall pointed blue hat, a long grey cloak, a silver scarf over which a white beard hung down below his waist.”

and Beorn:

"He changes his skin; sometimes he is a huge black bear, sometimes he is a great strong black-haired man with huge arms and a great beard."

seem to have had beards long enough to be remarked upon.

Though Balin does have a noticibly longer beard at the end.

“If Balin noticed that Mr. Baggins’ waistcoat was more extensive (and had real gold buttons), Bilbo also noticed that Balin’s beard was several inches longer…”

So the “Their beards aren’t long enough!!” really doesn’t seem to have any sort of validity at all except from a D&D viewpoint, and hopefully this is *not* another D&D movie!!

I really like these Dwarves! Nicely proportioned and very believable!

Great job, PJ!!

******************************************
Brothers, sisters,
I was Elf once.
We danced together
Under the Two Trees.
We sang as the soft gold of Laurelin
And the bright silver of Telperion,
Brought forth the dawn of the world.
Then I was taken.

Brothers, sisters,
In my torment I kept faith,
And I waited.
But you never came.
And when I returned you drew sword,
And when I called your names you drew bow.
Was my Eldar beauty all,
And my soul nothing?

So be it.
I will return your hatred,
And I am hungry.


Estel78
Tol Eressea

Jul 7 2011, 8:16pm


Views: 1244
All the dwarves in LOTR (which isn't a D&D movie) had long beards. ;) //

 


Darkstone
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 8:17pm


Views: 1249
Oh God I hope not!!

It's bad enough we had Vulcan Elves in LOTR, the last thing we need in The Hobbit are Vulcan Dwarves!!

Where do people get these crazy ideas?

******************************************
Brothers, sisters,
I was Elf once.
We danced together
Under the Two Trees.
We sang as the soft gold of Laurelin
And the bright silver of Telperion,
Brought forth the dawn of the world.
Then I was taken.

Brothers, sisters,
In my torment I kept faith,
And I waited.
But you never came.
And when I returned you drew sword,
And when I called your names you drew bow.
Was my Eldar beauty all,
And my soul nothing?

So be it.
I will return your hatred,
And I am hungry.


bookgirl13
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 8:20pm


Views: 1238
The Dwarven Death Pinch

Think how awesome it would be if dwarves could incapacitate their victims with a Spockian neck pinch - mind you they would have to carry around steps to reach the spot.


Darkstone
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 8:27pm


Views: 1219
Except for Gimli...

...all the Dwarves in the LOTR movie were either old or dead.

And some of the old Dwarves' beards were more full than long, and some of the dead ones barely had beards at all.

******************************************
Brothers, sisters,
I was Elf once.
We danced together
Under the Two Trees.
We sang as the soft gold of Laurelin
And the bright silver of Telperion,
Brought forth the dawn of the world.
Then I was taken.

Brothers, sisters,
In my torment I kept faith,
And I waited.
But you never came.
And when I returned you drew sword,
And when I called your names you drew bow.
Was my Eldar beauty all,
And my soul nothing?

So be it.
I will return your hatred,
And I am hungry.


Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 8:28pm


Views: 1237
This suddenly gives a whole new meaning to Legolas' question on the walls of Helm's Deep!

"Would you like me to find you a box?" Cool

My LiveJournal
My Costuming Site
TORn's Costume Discussions Archive


Darkstone
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 8:29pm


Views: 1203
Dwarves with pointy ears????

Gimli would just die.


And they wouldn't carry steps: "Do you want to kill him with your axe or do you want me to get you a box?"

******************************************
Brothers, sisters,
I was Elf once.
We danced together
Under the Two Trees.
We sang as the soft gold of Laurelin
And the bright silver of Telperion,
Brought forth the dawn of the world.
Then I was taken.

Brothers, sisters,
In my torment I kept faith,
And I waited.
But you never came.
And when I returned you drew sword,
And when I called your names you drew bow.
Was my Eldar beauty all,
And my soul nothing?

So be it.
I will return your hatred,
And I am hungry.


Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 8:34pm


Views: 1143
Do you think Spock would approve of Nori's eyebrows, though? //

 

My LiveJournal
My Costuming Site
TORn's Costume Discussions Archive


bookgirl13
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 8:34pm


Views: 1180
Pointy ears would go with Nori's pointy hairstyle

I forgot about the box - much better than steps Wink


Mooseboy018
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 8:37pm


Views: 1299
That's EXACTLY how I feel.

After having a certain image of the dwarves in my head for over ten years, seeing this picture was a little shocking at first.

But I LOVE the costumes, especially Ori's puffballs! And I think it's really cool how they took the description of Ori from LotR and gave him a book to carry. Gandalf reading what Ori wrote in the book of Mazarbul will be heartbreaking after getting to know Ori.Frown

Like a lot of people, I'm still a little iffy on their short beards, but I'll be happy as long as some of the dwarves have longer beards.

Nori's wacky hairstyle is the only thing I don't know if I'll ever get used to, but everything else is definitely growing on me already. I can't wait to see the rest of the dwarves!


(This post was edited by Mooseboy018 on Jul 7 2011, 8:39pm)


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 8:43pm


Views: 1153
Well, it does state specifically

that all of Dain's dwarves had their beards tucked into their belts.

Which sounds extremely painful.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


Mooseboy018
Grey Havens


Jul 7 2011, 8:48pm


Views: 1124
Me too.

I'm glad Dori is wearing purple, but one of the others should be too.

Not that it really matters...but it's one of those iconic details from the book that stuck with me since I was ten years old.Tongue


mulubinba
Rivendell

Jul 7 2011, 8:49pm


Views: 1148
Looking good ...

I like the look of them.... but then again I've always found it difficult to imagine their appearances from their descriptions in the book. Very exciting! I want to see them all now ...lol!!


KAOS82
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 8:54pm


Views: 1200
OMG where are dwarves hats???

btw not bad 4 the beginning, until movie will come out I will always wander how to distinguish/remember each dwarf...

TÚRIN TURAMBAR DAGNIR GLAURUNGA & NIENOR NÍNIEL


marillaraina
Rohan

Jul 7 2011, 9:04pm


Views: 1129
Just getting a chance to comment

I love them. I think they look terrific. To me they are giving dwarves a richer cultural heritage by moving beyond the Gimli look. He is one part of that cultural heritage.

The clothes, the styles they wear their hair, it speaks of a rich culture, a real and varied culture.

Why wouldn't a people who love making beautiful things, who made something as beautiful as the Mithril Chainmail which was first Bilbo's and then Frodo's, something meant to be worn, not also perhaps sometimes have interesting ways of doing their hair?

As for the outfits themselves, to me they look entirely in keeping with the clothing styles of Lord of the Rings and not too far off from what Gimli wore in general.

With regards to the beards, it looks to me like at least the two of them in the front have their beards braided, this would make them look shorter(I have long hair and I can say for a fact that when I braid it, it doesn't reach down as far as it does when it's loose:) and less bushy naturally.


(This post was edited by marillaraina on Jul 7 2011, 9:08pm)


Darkstone
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 9:04pm


Views: 1122
Yup

"The dwarves are exceedingly strong for their height, but most of these were strong even for dwarves. In battle they wielded heavy two-handed mattocks; but each of them had also a short broad sword at his side and a round shield slung at his back. Their beards were forked and plaited and thrust into their belts."

And indeed in the photo their beards appear forked and plaited, if not thrust into their belts. Two out of three ain't bad!

******************************************
Brothers, sisters,
I was Elf once.
We danced together
Under the Two Trees.
We sang as the soft gold of Laurelin
And the bright silver of Telperion,
Brought forth the dawn of the world.
Then I was taken.

Brothers, sisters,
In my torment I kept faith,
And I waited.
But you never came.
And when I returned you drew sword,
And when I called your names you drew bow.
Was my Eldar beauty all,
And my soul nothing?

So be it.
I will return your hatred,
And I am hungry.


Hengist
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 9:10pm


Views: 1119
Interesting

I like the look and Im getting a celtic vibe from Nori


" So let me get this straight. You want to fly on a magic carpet to see the King of the Potato People and plead with him for your freedom, and you're telling me you're completely sane? "


Elfhelm
The Shire

Jul 7 2011, 9:25pm


Views: 1084
Forgot to mention this earlier, but the photo seems somewhat "compressed" in the vertical to make them have more dwarvish proportions. n/t


In Reply To
... I think their body proportion in that photographs is more dwarf than man and I've been wondering how they managed it. They don't have the broad-headed look Gimli had, (I think a lot of that was achieved with his hair), but it you look at the proportion of their figures... Classically an adult man's head is one-eighth of his full height - or, put another way, body is about 7 head lengths. On this photo Dori's is five head lengths and the others look about the same. Don't understand it but it seems to me that's how it is.



DanielLB
Immortal

Jul 7 2011, 9:35pm


Views: 1070
Beard Length

Regarding the beard length, if people are worried that the Dwarves beards aren't long enough, go back and watch PJ's video blog. Plenty of long big (especially ginger) beards there. Can also spot Nori's at the same time, and Dori in costume.


QuackingTroll
Valinor


Jul 7 2011, 9:36pm


Views: 1208
And we thought antlers were a bad idea??

Nori has a star for a head. Ori has fake freckles and they all have massive ears, tiny heads and fat hands! Dwarves are supposed to look like this...



Nah, they're alright


(This post was edited by QuackingTroll on Jul 7 2011, 9:43pm)


namarie
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 9:38pm


Views: 1082
Then I guess I will start to grow

my brows and prepare for old age Wink


There is always hope


Buchanicus
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 9:40pm


Views: 1077
Beards...

I don't see why there's all the fuss about the length of their beards. All three have pretty siginificant beards...Ori a little less. But if you unbraided them and took out the "knots" and "ornaments" at the ends...there is no way you could look at them as short. Shorter than Gimli's? Definitely. But not short by any means. I think these looks hold up the Dwarf beard reputaion well. Don't be deceived by braids.

I'll say exactly what I said when I saw the first released image...Do these characters look like what I've always pictured in my head? No. Do I love the look and design of them for the movies? Yes. Most definitely yes!

TORn member formally known as ryan1976.


Nazger
The Shire


Jul 7 2011, 9:57pm


Views: 1082
Slightly caricitured?

Although the design shares some motifs with Gimli, they seem slightly caricatured to me. Maybe that's not the right word. There's just something about them that look a bit more over the top anything we saw in LOTR. Is this another sign that the lighter, more humerous tone of the book will not be LOTRized?


namarie
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 9:59pm


Views: 1061
Did anyone noticed the dwarven motifs from their clothes?

They can be seen on Ori's belt and on Nori's clothes.
They are the same motifs as the ones from Moria columns.

I think it's a nice way to make the conection with LOTR.


There is always hope


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 7 2011, 10:02pm


Views: 1028
But if that was the case...

... wouldn't their faces also look wider?

Whatever, I think they look really good. I wonder how long we have to wait for the next photo! Smile


tolkiennerd
Lorien


Jul 7 2011, 10:25pm


Views: 1236
They look great

It's nice to see they are not all going to look like Gimli.


renzn
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 10:34pm


Views: 1250
Geeking out man!

Maiarmike I'm with ya! I'm a 41 year old grandfather of two, but I'm totally "geeking" out now that this picture has been revealed. I just don't have the ability to create a mental image when reading a book, so these visuals aid me. I see multiple colors in their clothing not quite argyle, but something like that. They have working boots like anyone who uses manual labor tradesman would have, but it is the character in their hairstyles and adornments that are making them unique. They also have a sense of realism which makes the fantasy more realistic.


renzn
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 10:38pm


Views: 1298
BOLAS weapons?

Are those Bolas weapons hanging from Nori and Ori? Nori's looks a bit too light in a way like leather balls, but Ori's look metalic. Am I seeing it wrong?


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 10:50pm


Views: 1288
I am confused.

Why do you think the image was compressed?

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Hengist
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 7 2011, 11:04pm


Views: 1212
I think they may be tassles

from cloaks/hoods. Not sure though


" So let me get this straight. You want to fly on a magic carpet to see the King of the Potato People and plead with him for your freedom, and you're telling me you're completely sane? "


Bilbo Bling Just One Ring
The Shire

Jul 7 2011, 11:07pm


Views: 1222
Dori...

Looks a little like Kelsey Grammer.
Love the look of all three, can't wait to see the rest Smile


Oden
Rivendell


Jul 7 2011, 11:13pm


Views: 1199
Just a theory

and no factual support from the books (at least that I am aware of off the top of my head) but it might make sense that the dwarves in LOTR have longer beards because they are
1) older (except Gimli) and
2) have lived a somewhat "easier" lifestyle.

Let me try to explain, Thorin and company are dwarves without a home. This is the entire reason for their quest to recapture the Lonely Mountain from Smaug. Living life "outside" their home country and on the run might have impacted themselves physically, including possibly shorter beards.

It will be interesting to see the other 10 and see if some do have longer beards.


Phibbus
Rohan


Jul 7 2011, 11:17pm


Views: 1272
Look familiar?




Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 11:19pm


Views: 1209
All Right!

Now I understand that odd feeling like I have seen...

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



nenyacaster
Bree


Jul 7 2011, 11:28pm


Views: 1170
yes

I really like Nori's style; he looks very interesting. I'm sure when you take them out of this computer graphic setting and put them into a real forest, they won't look "cartoony" anymore.


Bombadil
Half-elven


Jul 7 2011, 11:32pm


Views: 1206
The Dwaves Develed too DEEP into their Beards?

There was no Barber tagging along with them, on the way to the Lonely Mountain?
I never recall anyone of them.... Even taking a BATH, once (Maybe? at Elrond's or Beorn's Hospice?)
I's sure they s++t in woods, of Mirkwood?
They were so Stinking No wonder Spiders, Flys and other creepy crawling things were Drawn to their Stink.?
Now, I realize why the WoodElveKing locked them UP!

Poor Bilbo, he probably was really Glad to keep his distance...often...

The Mob-of the MORE Bizarre the Dwaves are...
the Merrier to me.
(I can smell them, even Now, from just from one Pictrue?)
You have to remember they are the Utimate Anti-Heros!

It's all Great, and there is a Stink!!! Rising out of Wellinton as we speak! xoxxo OB


(This post was edited by Bombadil on Jul 7 2011, 11:34pm)


lurtz2010
Rohan

Jul 7 2011, 11:56pm


Views: 1131
looks like the bright coloured hoods are out then

probably a good thing


LittleTook
The Shire


Jul 8 2011, 12:07am


Views: 1136
Ori the Faun?!

Now I know why Ori seems so familiar and yet odd looking? Mr. Tumnus anyone? Yeah, With that nose and goatee going on he reminds me very much of a Narnian faun. While I'm not a huge fan Of C.S. Lewis or his works, I do love Mr. Tumnus so it might be hard to focus on poor Ori as a Dwarf!

* * *

"Faithless is he who says farewell when the road darkens." ~Gimli

"Despair is only for those who see the end beyond all doubt. We do not." ~ Gandalf


Richie Rich
Rivendell


Jul 8 2011, 12:28am


Views: 1229
For those of you who are interested in their costumes...

I've lightened up the image a bit so you can see more of the details in their costumes: http://i56.tinypic.com/r01c7d.jpg

It's pretty clear to me that this is not just a standard photograph of three guys in costumes. I'm willing to bet that they digitally stuck the actors' heads onto little people, and then composited the three together to make this image. It also looks to me like Starfish's hair was altered digitally as well. This is, of course, just my opinion. Angelic



(This post was edited by Richie Rich on Jul 8 2011, 12:33am)


Mooseboy018
Grey Havens


Jul 8 2011, 12:32am


Views: 1112
His hood/scarf thing even reminds me of his animated self.

Ori and Nori



Otaku-sempai
Immortal

Jul 8 2011, 12:37am


Views: 1104
Oops! I seem to have confused Ori with Nori...

Dispite their descriptions, Ori is the one who looks to me like he's up to mischief wrapped up in his hood and cloak, while Nori has the sense of sartorial style (not that Dori's outfit isn't pretty snazzy too). At least they are a bit better armed than they were in the book (assuming that they didn't liberate these weapons from Smaug's hoard).


(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Jul 8 2011, 12:43am)


adu
Bree

Jul 8 2011, 12:54am


Views: 1122
Hey Kangi!

I am interested to know what your thoughts were to the picture of our 3 dwarves.


dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 8 2011, 1:13am


Views: 1153
How clever!

Of you, for lightening the picture, thank you! And of the clothing design team - you can see how they've "transformed" these three!

Tall Jed Brophy is bending his knees so he's not towering over the other two.

And note: the oversized boots, long over-coats which help to put the waistline a bit lower than their own waists (note the location of elbows vs. clothing waistlines on Nori and Dori, versus Ori's more "normal" waist), lots of padding, what must be "hand gloves" on Ori (who mentioned this earlier in this thread?) - all the ways that are employed to make them look shorter and squatter.

Even the addition of bulbous noses! I wonder if Jed had a hand in designing his hair?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


"I desired dragons with a profound desire"

"It struck me last night that you might write a fearfully good romantic drama, with as much of the 'supernatural' as you cared to introduce. Have you ever thought of it?"
-Geoffrey B. Smith, letter to JRR Tolkien, 1915




AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 1:31am


Views: 1027
Awesome. That makes me happy in a nostalgia laced way.

Also, I wonder if Nori's crazy hair is any indication that we might get the book described blue beard for one of the dwarves after all. It couldn't be any more zany than that hairdo. lol

In Reply To


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 1:37am


Views: 1083
I am still evaluating the picture.

They are very interesting. I would say that the 13 together would be overwhelming at this point. It is probably good that they are letting them out a few at a time. The outfits they are wearing are up to the standards that I came to love with Peter's Lord of the Rings films. The hair is very interesting. I want to see it from other angles. I was already certain that there were going to be a diversity of beards and hair styles from statements made earlier by people in the production so that was no surprise. I think it is neat that it appears that each of the Dwarves is being given a special social function. (Scribe, Warrior, Shaman) I really am looking forward to seeing the rest of the boys (and girls). I do not care who designed them. It is a team effort that is bringing them to us.

Chip the glasses break the plates that's what Bilbo Baggins hates...Laugh

Oh, and by the way I haven't noticed you around much so I am glad to see you and let us know what you think about these guys.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



(This post was edited by Kangi Ska on Jul 8 2011, 1:39am)


LordElrond
Rivendell


Jul 8 2011, 1:48am


Views: 1050
amazing constumes

they have that detail that the costumes in the lotr trilogy had like you could just reach out and touch them, just beautiful Smile. I don't know what to think of that starfish hairstyle though, they should release a 360 view for that one


taekotemple
Grey Havens


Jul 8 2011, 1:48am


Views: 1113
Trying to offer some new thoughts.

I read through this whole thread, partially because I wanted to see what others had to say, but also so that I don't just repeat what everyone else is saying. I'm fond of adding new ideas to an existing conversation anyway.

I have a lot of thoughts about the description of these three very interesting dwarves. Because of the number of dwarves and how limited the time each of them gets in the novel, it makes sense to expand their characters for the films, both for the sake of the viewers, and for the sake of the actors. Having had to make up motivations/character traits for characters in plays when no clear motive or character traits popped out in a script before, I wonder how much the actors had a say in how they wanted to characterize their individual dwarf. One of the fun thing about playing a less clearly developed character is that you can push the boundaries of character more. I hope that in the writing and re-writes of the script, the actors are being encouraged to come up with their backstory and add to helping make their characters more distinctive.

Love, love, love the costuming. I so loved Ngila Dickson's designs, and finding out that she would not be doing the costuming for The Hobbit, I was a little worried/disappointed. Color me relieved!

I think it's great that they have braided beards. Much more practical, considering they're essentially homeless dwarves, and likely haven't had the luxury of frequent baths, access to hairbrushes and combs, etc. I'm kinda hoping that one or two of the dwarves have just let their hair go to dreads. I know that with my crazy thick hair, if I were forced to live off the land, I'd keep it braided. Also very practical for battle, not having excess hair in one's face to block your vision.

Nori's starfish hair... I was thinking it was kinda Dragonball Z. I'm wondering if Nori might be a bit vain or foppish? Maybe he's a bit of the charming rogue type? Anyway, I want to see the hair in action, as a part of me doesn't completely trust the picture.

Dori looks pretty cool. He seems more traditional, in a sense. A little more like a warrior, compared to his two brothers. The sword is very interesting. We got to see Gimli's dwarven axes, but it's cool to see other dwarf styled weaponry (of course, I'm assuming it's dwarf weaponry here.) It seems to fit the dwarf asthetic, a little more blocky and practical, something that chops and hacks rather than stabs.

Ori was the one that stood out to me as being the most unexpected (despite Nori's hair.) I like the whole setup, though. I like the idea of a dwarf who isn't necessarily a stereotypical warrior dwarf or mining dwarf. I like the idea that dwarves don't have to have that homogenous a culture that there isn't room for a more studious dwarf.

Overall, very interesting, and definitely makes me want to see more of the other dwarves.


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 8 2011, 1:55am


Views: 1115
If you go on Facebook, either to the Hobbit official page, or PJ's page...

a lot of people are saying, "Leik, it wuld be cool fur longerrr beardzzz, PLZ!1!, moar leik gimli!". Now I know why I hate Facebook.

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 1:55am


Views: 1054
See what you mean

If you look at Jed's right ear and the line of slight discolouration on the middle guy's cloak, just at Jed's left elbow, the image does look like a composite.


droidsocket
Lorien

Jul 8 2011, 1:58am


Views: 1049
I say Gimli fits right in!

Its a crappy photo shop job but thought it would be fun to compare!
Attachments: dwarves.jpg (33.6 KB)


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 2:01am


Views: 1162
That is why I generally avoid reading the 4000+ comments

or adding to them. Evil

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 2:03am


Views: 1108
Great thanks. It is a keeper. //

 

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



LordElrond
Rivendell


Jul 8 2011, 2:04am


Views: 1140
I saw comments like that

I hope Peter Jackson doesn't read them


taekotemple
Grey Havens


Jul 8 2011, 2:07am


Views: 1165
Well, considering how poor the spelling is...

he may not want to take the time to try to decipher what they're saying.

It scares me, the way the level of spelling and grammar has reduced itself to online. I can handle the LOL's and the OMG!'s, but sometimes it's like they're typing in some weird code.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 2:09am


Views: 1138
I think

The stripe at Jed's elbo is actually part of the other Dwarf's cloak design. (Maybe)

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 2:27am


Views: 1095
You may be right

whatever they did to make this image (and I mean every detail) I like what I'm seeing!


lurtz2010
Rohan

Jul 8 2011, 2:31am


Views: 1143
thehobbitftw?

his posts are shocking but I love them. I cringe when I see some of the stupid things people say and ask on PJs facebook page, I know I can't really talk with some of the things I say on here but still...


Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 2:32am


Views: 1095
Tassles on Ori's cloak, I think, but not Dori's

Pompoms if you want to get really specific. But Dori's look like weighted chains (bolas) to me.

My LiveJournal
My Costuming Site
TORn's Costume Discussions Archive


duats
Grey Havens

Jul 8 2011, 2:39am


Views: 1112
So far so good

But Nori's hair looks laughably bad, to the point of distraction. My eyes are drawn to it immediately, and something that calls attention to itself to THAT large of an extent doesn't belong here. Unlike Dori's, this doesn't look like "real" hair. As someone else pointed out, it looks like a cheap wig someone would use for a Dragonball Z film. And the photoshop cut/paste job certainly isn't helping matters much.

It's a shame, really, because Nori is perfect from the forehead down. The hair kills it, though.

I have no complaints regarding Dori and Ori.


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 8 2011, 2:47am


Views: 1219
I have a feeling, or rather a sneeking suspicion...

...that they released these first to sort of acquaint us with the "oddball" look they're going for this time around, and Nori may look a little more normal in the film. I don't quite understand WB's intention on surgically altering all the photos we've been getting lately either, but who knows. I think the rest of the dwarves will be unique, but some of them may look a lot more like the typical long-bearded dwarves we've seen in the trilogy. Again, I think they wanted to shock us a bit with the first one.

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Jul 8 2011, 2:52am


Views: 1111
psst....that pic is slightly over the guidelines

at 600 x 395 pixels (237,000 pixels squared) the pic is slightly over our guidelines of 210,000 pixels squared (dimensions of 525 x 400 for example). Thanks for tweaking it down just a little more next time. Smile

(for more info, see item 2.20 in the FAQ on the Welcome board)


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase



TORn Calendar


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 8 2011, 2:54am


Views: 1095
If you'll notice though.

Those dwarves don't have their hair tucked and braided. If Nori, Dori, and Ori let their hair out, and beards out, they would probably look similar.

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


Mad Hatter of Middle-Earth
Lorien


Jul 8 2011, 2:59am


Views: 1176
My first thought: Oh God!!! The hobbit is in CGI!

This pic is awesome and the more I study it the more satisified I become! Great job PJ! I want to see Fili and Kili! (they are my fav dwarfs):-) So glad the Hobbit isn't in CGI!!!

All you have to decide is what to do with the time that has been given to you...


eralkfang
Lorien


Jul 8 2011, 3:03am


Views: 1080
Hmm…

I'm starting to wonder if there isn't more of a significance to the hair and beards being bound than simply practicality's sake—after all, Gimli managed with fairly light braiding, by these new standards. Perhaps Thorin has bound his hair and beard in… uh… let's go with mourning until Erebor is recovered, and the twelve companions have followed suit?

Of course, now that I've said this, Thorin will have nary a braid in hair or beard…


Mad Hatter of Middle-Earth
Lorien


Jul 8 2011, 3:07am


Views: 1081
I like humor but...

I hope they don't overdue it and make the Hobbit a childish movie. I expect LOTR quality or more. But I really hope there is enough battle scenes to make this a PG-13 movie. I'm sure I won't be dissapointed though!

All you have to decide is what to do with the time that has been given to you...


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Jul 8 2011, 3:23am


Views: 1109
I agree

The recent pic, especially, is ultra-staged.

Remember the distinct differences between "early-Gimli" and "final-Gimli" in the LOTR movies? Especially with respect to the TE and the EE?

I do think you're on to something Maiarmike.

Staged or not, I'm very encouraged! They're obviously making a concerted effort to differentiate the dwarves from one another.


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase



TORn Calendar


Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 8 2011, 3:39am


Views: 1037
You don't think

some of that might have to do with the shape of JRD's head and general build? They cast a variety of body shapes for dwarves this time around, I don't see why their heads should all be expected to look like Gimli's.

Silverlode

"Of all faces those of our familiares are the ones both most difficult to play fantastic tricks with, and most difficult really to see with fresh attention. They have become like the things which once attracted us by their glitter, or their colour, or their shape, and we laid hands on them, and then locked them in our hoard, acquired them, and acquiring ceased to look at them.
Creative fantasy, because it is mainly trying to do something else [make something new], may open your hoard and let all the locked things fly away like cage-birds. The gems all turn into flowers or flames, and you will be warned that all you had (or knew) was dangerous and potent, not really effectively chained, free and wild; no more yours than they were you."
-On Fairy Stories


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 4:15am


Views: 1029
I really do not believe

that the movie will not be PG13. There be lots of fightin afore the end.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 4:18am


Views: 1070
I think the alterations to the photos

has to do with how the actors will look in the film. It will be heavily worked over to say the least. Plus it will be in 3-D.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



stormcrow20
Gondor


Jul 8 2011, 8:27am


Views: 948
Quite a dwarven trio!

Just like the last round of photos, I've gone back to this one countless times throughout the day, taking in every little detail. This is so exciting!

I am among those who thought it was a photo of high quality collectible figures or something from Sideshow, until I clicked on the larger high-res version. Admittedly, I didn't like much of what I saw at first, but the shock has worn off and everything has grown on me quite a lot (even Nori's hair!). Dori looks very impressive and noble, Ori seems quiet and withdrawn (though I hope not timid), and mischief is burning brightly in Nori's eyes!

After watching the LotR trilogy for the first time in a long while when it was in theaters recently, I'm surprised to say that I enjoyed Gimli much more than I have in the past. Sure, there were still some cringeworthy, over-the-top moments, but overall the humor was much more tolerable this time around. His eagerness to fight, his growls and especially "Oooh, come on we can take 'em!" were the best uses of the humor, in my opinion. So I'm open to a little more dwarven humor in that particular vein. Although Tolkien's own humor should definitely take precedence.

I love the dwarven style in the costumes, weapons and accessories. I love the contrast between Dori's formidable bolas and Ori's fluffy tassels! And I love Nori's club-staff! I can't wait to see it in action. Just the look of these weapons and attitudes leaves us with a promise that the battles should be a hacking, bashing, romping, stomping good time!



A greenlight from the shadows shall spring!


Mythopoeia
Bree

Jul 8 2011, 9:08am


Views: 926
It looks like Dori's seriously considering chopping off Nori's starfish hair

Wink

. . . Actually and to my own surprise I'm finding that I like the hair, though. I'll agree with everyone else in that I want to see it from different angles though, to figure out what's holding it up.


Gimli1252
Bree


Jul 8 2011, 9:22am


Views: 922
they ...

are awesome .... nothing more nothing less...

''There is one dwarf yet in Moria, who still draws breath''

(This post was edited by Hengist on Jul 8 2011, 1:36pm)


Ececheira
Bree


Jul 8 2011, 9:52am


Views: 887
Thanks

Thank you for that. The costumes are very impressive and I look forward to seeing more. The only thing that really struck me was how similar Ori is to this fellow...

http://disney.wikia.com/wiki/Dopey

Perhaps I am being unjust.


(This post was edited by Ececheira on Jul 8 2011, 9:54am)


DrDeath153
Lorien

Jul 8 2011, 10:02am


Views: 888
Of course

But the humour comes not from the fact the dwarves are all stand-up comedians but rather from their attitudes, particularly their self-importance. Gimli is funny (in the book) but rather humourless as a character- the comedy comes from his bloody-mindedness and grim disposition and how it rubs uneasily on everything it comes in contact with: his refusal to sing of the 'east wind' during their elegy for Boromir suddenly cuts the poetic tension by revealing a somewhat superstitious angle to him.

Likewise in The Hobbit, while the dwarves are lighter, frequently depicted as quite immature- bickering, moaning about absent comforts (in fact they do significantly more moaning than Bilbo who isn't as used to this life as they), they are not cracking jokes and rarely, with the exception of Fili and Kili make light of dangerous situations. The character of them suggests that they do everything in their power to be taken seriously and respectably; Nori as depicted here looks like a kind of Catweazle-type dotty druid. It's not going to be fatal to the group as a whole, but i don't particularly like it.

Dr Death


phredegar
Bree

Jul 8 2011, 10:36am


Views: 843
Dori

 - on first sight I was reminded of Captain Nemo from the ill received 'League of Extraordinary Gentlemen'...(I thought Nemo was the coolest).


bookgirl13
Lorien


Jul 8 2011, 10:47am


Views: 1165
Londo Mollari

Nori's hair appears similar to Londo's and other Centauri in Babylon 5. Nothing was needed to hold their hair up apart from lots of lacquer. Perhaps the designer worked with Straczynski on that TV show?


DrDeath153
Lorien

Jul 8 2011, 11:00am


Views: 1177
It has something to do with it

But John Rhys Davies was formidably dwarvish even before a scrap of rubber was applied to his face. I must admit when i first saw Gimli i thought it was the actor's real face (i hadn't seen John Rhys Davies before) and when i heard about the prosthetics it did make me wonder why on earth they'd need to, but it was reading all the behind the scenes stuff that made me realise the wisdom of it in the silhouette it created, the kind of bullish, squat lump, instantly recognisable as a dwarf. I can appreciate you saying that they wanted more of a variety of body shapes, and will throw the 'Dungeons and Dragons' argument around (i.e. that our perceptions of dwarves as being so short and stocky is a creation of later influences), but in fact Tolkien was very fond of providing his different races, even different lines within them with distinct physiology- take the hobbits- Tolkien made quite clear very distinctive physiological differences between the Stoors, the Harfoots and the Fallowhides, as shown in this piece of artwork: http://tolkiengateway.net/...bbits_comparison.jpg. These types were not rigidly adhered in the film and yet something of them existed- Elijah Wood was very much of the Fallowhide look, Dominic Monaghan was less fey and more 'average' by human standards so was a fairly good match for a Hobbit with Stoor stock, while Sean Astin was more of a Harfoot fellow. I'm sure Peter Jackson didn't cast them with that in mind, but they conveniently fit those types.

Given the restrictiveness and labour involved in John Rhys Davies transformation into i was well aware there was a conflict with continuity when it came to The Hobbit. The director would likely wish his dwarven actors to have more ability to emote and less time spent applying the prosthetics, as such, minimising the amount of prosthetics applied could only be a good thing but that would mean casting established 'dwarfy' actors- probably no-one under 45 and no tall, strapping types. On the other hand, he wanted his dwarves each to be unique and distinct from each other, and so would select actors with the ability to portray unique personalities irrespective of body type and 'dwarf them up' with prosthetics, knowing the strength of their acting abilities would shine through. What annoys me is that he has done both- casting actors who fall far outside the dwarven body-type and yet not compensating with prosthetics. They've gone through make-up sure, but they're still just normal humans wearing dwarven hand-me-downs.

Defending the more human proportions is all well and good, yeah, perhaps you could have 'tall' (for their race) skinny dwarves like Nori, but lets flip it the other way- could you have short, fat elves? Christopher Tolkien didn't think so, theorising that Salgant; Maeglin's squat, cowardly sidekick in the original Fall of Gondolin of 1917, would likely not reflect Tolkien's matured concept of elves and would have been readjusted to fit.

Ironically PJ's conception of Middle-earth humans (at least those fighting for good) doesn't seem as varied either- all the key heroes follow the 'generic middle-earth action hero' mould of being fairly tall, medium to slightly slender/muscular build, shoulder-length hair, designer stubble possibly forming a discrete tache or nominal beard and in the prime of their life. You don't see any of the like of Forlong- the wobbling, aged Sancho Panza type or the wiry bean-poles that exist in our world. Given those facts, i don't see any non-cynical reason for trying to humanise the proportions (or facial hair) of dwarves.

Dr Death


kiwifan
Rohan

Jul 8 2011, 11:52am


Views: 1187
but they are not homeless!

First Oden came up with this idea, now you say these dwarves were essentially homeless --- but they were not, they were living in exile in the Ered Luin (the Blue Mountains, northwest of the Shire) by the time Gandalf came up with the idea to deal with Smaug by using the Dwarves who wanted revenge and their former home (the Lonely Mountain) and their treasure back (see The Unfinished Tales, in 'The quest for Erebor'). When Gandalf met Thorin on the road, he 'went with him to his halls in the Blue Mountains' to discuss his plans. And, being Dwarves and thus very industrious, they had managed to become reasonably well-to-do. If they were homeless vagabonds, they'd never be able to afford such rich clothing as they're wearing in this picture.

I like the clothes, I dislike Nori's ridiculous hairdo, and I don't think that club thing of his would make a very efficient weapon (I wonder what John Howe thinks of it!).

'Goodness gracious, you really are a messie!' 'Oh no, I'm not, these are all just mathoms...'


Malveth The Eternal
Lorien

Jul 8 2011, 12:22pm


Views: 1176
Ugh...PJ strikes again...

Hideous, awful, pointless, stupid...I hate it! Is the whole movie going to look that awful?
No thanks.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/CarrotField/257960949766?created


Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 8 2011, 12:42pm


Views: 1100
But tell us how you really feel.//

 

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules."
--Walter Sobchak


Alientraveller
Lorien

Jul 8 2011, 1:00pm


Views: 1117
I didn't realise that was Nori's hair

It looks so odd. It's like Dori's still wondering to himself why his brother has such a bizarre sense of style.

Love the hammer and sword though, and are those flails dangling from Dori's belt?


architecthis
Lorien


Jul 8 2011, 1:19pm


Views: 1161
As far as all the doctored up theories

I use Photoshop EVERY DAY and the images are just hi res and color corrected IMO. I think we should expect both films to have a distinct look since peter did this with all three LOTR films, King Kong, The Lovely Bones (sepia tones) .

They may have edited the edge around the starfish haircut to emphasize it's shape but that is all I see that looks possibly photo-shopped and with that being said I'm not even convinced that that area was touched up....it's not that hard for WETA to create that wig.

If anything the image and the other 3 or four that we've seen over the past few weeks are just very high quality - with the exception of Bilbo and the dwarves in bag end where the dwarves are purposely rendered out of focus with a depth of field filter.


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 8 2011, 1:22pm


Views: 1100
'Nori's hair looks laughably bad'

Dori and Ori may well agree. I think Nori's hair will be a source of humour.


Darkstone
Immortal

Jul 8 2011, 2:47pm


Views: 1044
Star shaped hair.

I know a guy or three down in Dallas who sport star-shaped hair. They're not the type of people you should call "stupid" to their face if you want to stay out of the hospital. Or the morgue.

I've traveled around a bit. One thing I learned is not to call how people look, dress, or part their hair "stupid" because they're probably thinking the same thing about you. (But hey, some people never grow out of that childish self-assurance that how they dress, what they eat, and how they behave is the one and only correct way. Overseas they're called "Ugly Americans".)

I'd suppose Nori, Ori, and Dori could look more Abercrombie and Fitch, but personally I think they'd look a bit strange in crewcuts and t-shirts with a little alligator on.

But hey, some people may think that's the perfect Dwarf look.

Different strokes.

******************************************
Brothers, sisters,
I was Elf once.
We danced together
Under the Two Trees.
We sang as the soft gold of Laurelin
And the bright silver of Telperion,
Brought forth the dawn of the world.
Then I was taken.

Brothers, sisters,
In my torment I kept faith,
And I waited.
But you never came.
And when I returned you drew sword,
And when I called your names you drew bow.
Was my Eldar beauty all,
And my soul nothing?

So be it.
I will return your hatred,
And I am hungry.


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 8 2011, 2:47pm


Views: 988
Well yes!

I still think there is some kind of structure there but I can see no one else does so, if there isn't, and it is just a hairdo, I can't see it staying like that for long. Assuming dwarves haven't invented hair gel, how could a construction like that ever survive life on the road, trolls, spiders, barrels, eagles, goblin fights and so on? And he'll have trouble getting a helmet over that. At some point he'll have to acquire a more lived-in look. Same with Dori, in fact. His style is more modest but it's ever so neat and tidy.
I reckon these designs are a starting point - and yes, I can see them having fun with Nori's hair too.


Oden
Rivendell


Jul 8 2011, 2:53pm


Views: 995
Yes

I showed the image to my children last night and the first thing one of my daughters said is that Ori looks like Mr Tumnus.

The two faces definitely have some resemblance.


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 8 2011, 2:54pm


Views: 989
Are you sure?

Because I use Photoshop a lot too and I think I can see possible signs of alteration in the area round the feet. I just feel there has to have been some kind of alteration because those three figures don't have the body proportions of adult men - and, as we know, quite tall men. Seems to me the difference is more than you could achieve with costume alone. I reckon there may have been some alteration below the hemline of each, to make the legs appear shorter. I don't see how else they could change their proportion - except, as someone suggested, use the bodies of scale doubles, but alteration around the head is much more noticeable than it is round the feet.


Darkstone
Immortal

Jul 8 2011, 3:00pm


Views: 955
I wonder...

...if it's supposed to intentionally go with his implied "gangsta' persona.

******************************************
Brothers, sisters,
I was Elf once.
We danced together
Under the Two Trees.
We sang as the soft gold of Laurelin
And the bright silver of Telperion,
Brought forth the dawn of the world.
Then I was taken.

Brothers, sisters,
In my torment I kept faith,
And I waited.
But you never came.
And when I returned you drew sword,
And when I called your names you drew bow.
Was my Eldar beauty all,
And my soul nothing?

So be it.
I will return your hatred,
And I am hungry.


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 8 2011, 3:05pm


Views: 957
Maybe

It does seem to fit the image. I think he has a slightly piratical (is that a word??) look about him.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 3:08pm


Views: 996
I think that the hair-doo in question

will be revealed to have a significant Dwarf cultural reason for existing that will be revealed within the films. If the character functions, as some comments have suggested, as a shaman then the hair could have ritual significance. I think we will learn the reason and eat all the snarky comments. After all a third of humanity decorates their places of worship with a bloody corps nailed to an ancient instrument of torture placed at the center of honor. What's a little weird hair.Evil

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



architecthis
Lorien


Jul 8 2011, 3:31pm


Views: 942
Possibly

While I think the costumes are designed to emphasize the vertical proportions above the waist I'm not saying they haven't been scaled in any way. That sort of thing can be done relatively easy for each frame of a film.

What I meant was that a lot of people seem to think the overall look of the photo and the make up on the characters is something supernatural, and I don't believe it is. I think these images will be consistent with the look of the movie, or are at least hinting at it.


taekotemple
Grey Havens


Jul 8 2011, 3:35pm


Views: 989
How do I respond to this?

I did say "essentially homeless." That does not mean "actually homeless." There is a certain mentality a person can take on when they know their home is somewhere but they can't be there (I've been in this position before.) One does go into survival mode, tending towards practical in some ways. When you feel like your home is elsewhere, no matter where you live, you can feel like everything is temporary. I'm sure, with the dwarves' great desire to get their home that they've been exiled from back, even if they live someplace comfortable, they probably feel how very temporary it is.

As to their clothing... Sometimes rich looking clothes can also have practical applications. Fur lined boots may be a luxury to us in places like the U.S., but serve a very practical application to people who live in extremely cold climates, for example. I also don't think their costumes shown in this picture were all particularly rich looking. Some may be, but some looks quite practical. Some, especially the more decorative parts of their costuming, could be pieces that can last longer than most clothing, like belts and jewlery type pieces.

Homeless doesn't have to mean poor, by the way, nor does it have to mean they're vagabonds. For example, my older brother decided to "live off the land" for a while. He was "essentially homeless." He wasn't some undesireable who couldn't get a job, he had money to pay his way if he needed. It just means they don't have the place they call home available to them.

I'm trying to tone my response down, by the way, as I'm a little frustrated. It seems like people are getting to the point where useage of certain words gets torn down and broken apart and misinterpreted instead of trying to understand a person's point. It's happened to me a few times here in the Hobbit board and it's frustrating.


Arwen's daughter
Half-elven


Jul 8 2011, 4:26pm


Views: 924
I'm reminded of a certain Irish "bog man"

He lived around 300 BCE and was found with a jar of early hair gel (vegetable oil mixed with pine resin). Experts think he might have used it to make himself appear taller and more threatening. Sounds like something a dwarf might need!

My LiveJournal
My Costuming Site
TORn's Costume Discussions Archive


QuackingTroll
Valinor


Jul 8 2011, 4:54pm


Views: 945
Oin and Gloin picture!!!

They look perfect!!! http://www-images.theonering.org/...7/6970_912526707.jpg


(This post was edited by QuackingTroll on Jul 8 2011, 4:58pm)


maut
Rivendell


Jul 8 2011, 4:59pm


Views: 882
Hey,

who's seeking for beardes?
I like them more than previous three!

Far over the misty mountains cold

To dungeons deep and caverns old

We must away ere break of day

To seek the pale enchanted gold.
__________________________________
...and the sound of the kettle on his hearth was ever after more musical than it had been even in the quiet days before the Unexpected Party

________________________________
Welcome back to Middle-Earth!!!


Jim
Rivendell


Jul 8 2011, 5:02pm


Views: 997
Great!

Looks like they are going to give each "group" of Dwarves a unique style to help the audience distinguish between them. First Nori, Dori and Ori and now we've got Gloin and Oin. That leaves us with:

1) Dwalin and Balin
2) Fili and Kili
3) Bofur, Bifur and Bombur
4) Thorin


sushiking
The Shire


Jul 8 2011, 5:02pm


Views: 1007
AWESOME!!!

OMFG GIMIL'S FATHER!!!! XD


dormouse
Half-elven

Jul 8 2011, 5:05pm


Views: 1004
They look good!

They're coming thick and fast now - I wonder who we'll have next!


DrDeath153
Lorien

Jul 8 2011, 5:07pm


Views: 965
Now we're talking!

There's still a couple of head problems but these are dwarves of the like i'm after! Callen on the left and Hambleton on the right yes? I'm very happy, positively smilingLaugh. I'm very happy with what they've done with Peter Hambleton particularly- he was a bit of a big bald enigma in person but it's plain they've taken leads from Gimli with his colour scheme and equipment (Gimli's beloved walking axe) and yet he's not a straight up copy either- he actually seems quite tall and slim but still in proportion for a dwarf. As for John Callen well i've been a fan since he gave us a bio and pictures, completely aware of his own obscurity. He has heart that man and Oin is by far my favourite dwarf design of the five we've seen so far- the beard is big enough, the head squat enough, the features lumpy enough and the costume dwarven down to his little feet. Is his staff the rather odd looking pole-arm we saw getting honed on a linishing table in the production diary?

Take a snapshot, this is likely as happy as you'll see me for many a month Angelic

Dr Death


RoseCotton
Lorien


Jul 8 2011, 5:08pm


Views: 999
Oh, ye of little faith? ;-)

Not that I mean 'ye' personally... Angelic


Patty
Immortal


Jul 8 2011, 5:24pm


Views: 1301
Yeah! He looks like he did in LotR...

the brief glimpse that we got of him arriving in Rivendell with Gimli.Cool

Permanent address: Into the West





Darkstone
Immortal

Jul 8 2011, 5:26pm


Views: 1298
Yeah

I knew what you meant, and to me it made perfect sense.

Over the years I've noticed some people seem to go out of their way to take deliberate umbrage over this phrase or that word or those pictures, simply in order demonstrate how big a real fan they are.

As for myself, I'm happy being Not A Real Fan.

******************************************
Brothers, sisters,
I was Elf once.
We danced together
Under the Two Trees.
We sang as the soft gold of Laurelin
And the bright silver of Telperion,
Brought forth the dawn of the world.
Then I was taken.

Brothers, sisters,
In my torment I kept faith,
And I waited.
But you never came.
And when I returned you drew sword,
And when I called your names you drew bow.
Was my Eldar beauty all,
And my soul nothing?

So be it.
I will return your hatred,
And I am hungry.


Black Breathalizer
Rohan


Jul 8 2011, 6:36pm


Views: 1197
oops

The caption is WRONG. They have the names reversed. The photo is of Ori, Nori and Dori.


kiwifan
Rohan

Jul 8 2011, 6:38pm


Views: 1238
You're not the only frustrated person around here

 


since I guess it's now my turn to feel misunderstood Frown


This was the part of Oden's post 'Just a theory' (from Thursday, in this same thread, which you wrote that you had read through) that I was referring to first:

----
'Just a theory ... and no factual support from the books (at least that I am aware of off the top of my head) but it might make sense that the dwarves in LOTR have longer beards because they are
1) older (except Gimli) and
2) have lived a somewhat "easier" lifestyle.

Let me try to explain, Thorin and company are dwarves without a home. This is the entire reason for their quest to recapture the Lonely Mountain from Smaug. Living life "outside" their home country and on the run might have impacted themselves physically, including possibly shorter beards.'
----

which is pretty clear: He (Oden) says they are on the run which to me implies being on the road, without a fixed abode. (Nothing 'essential' about that type of homelessness, to my mind).


And this was the part of your post I was referring to:
----
'I think it's great that they have braided beards. Much more practical, considering they're essentially homeless dwarves, and likely haven't had the luxury of frequent baths, access to hairbrushes and combs, etc. I'm kinda hoping that one or two of the dwarves have just let their hair go to dreads. I know that with my crazy thick hair, if I were forced to live off the land, I'd keep it braided. Also very practical for battle, not having excess hair in one's face to block your vision.'
-----

Why are you upset that I deduced that you meant 'homeless' (as without a fixed abode, see my point above re Oden's post)? After all, you said that they likely didn't have access to bathrooms and all these amenities. That, to me at least, implies that you think they do live on the road. Well, if my maths based on the LotR appendices is correct, Thorin had been living, working and amassing modest wealth in the Blue Mountains for about 90 years or so, which to me signifies plenty of time to build bathrooms etc. and to have a fairly settled life. If by 'essentially homeless' you mean 'homesick', yes, that I agree with unreservedly.




'Goodness gracious, you really are a messie!' 'Oh no, I'm not, these are all just mathoms...'


Garfeimao
Rohan


Jul 8 2011, 6:42pm


Views: 1267
I don't think that hairdo will survive the journey

My bet is that they are all gussied up for the big meet and greet with each other, with Gandalf, and with his recommendation for a Thief. But after they are stuffed into bags by the Trolls and wrapped up in spider webbing, I have a feeling they will all get a little grungier and lose some of their luster as they get into and out of various tangles. The star shaped hairdo may we get a big squashed, and some of the decorative hair jewelry may also wind up missing.

But then, Gimli managed to stay rather unblemished most of the time too, so maybe the Dwarves have an almost magical ability remain clean like the Elves so clearly do.

Peace, Love and Rock & Roll,


Garfeimao
The orange stripey One



Cruise to Middle-earth


Phibbus
Rohan


Jul 8 2011, 7:00pm


Views: 1196
Yes, maybe...


In Reply To
so maybe the Dwarves have an almost magical ability remain clean like the Elves so clearly do.


Just not their fingernails.


Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 8 2011, 7:21pm


Views: 1181
Species variation in Tolkien

I think you're being a little rigid in your categorizations, even more than the text actually indicates. While I would not expect an elf to be short and pudgy, there are a number of Elves throughout the legendarium that are specifically mentioned to be more-than-usually-tall, which to me argues a bit of variation within type. Of course, Tolkien allowed for a very wide range of types for Men - from the Dunedain and Gondorians with their Elvish blood (royal men), to the Rohirrim (noble men), to the Dunlendings (wild men) and the aboriginal (Woses). Hobbits are also a wide variety - if you re-read the intro to LOTR, he mentions a quite wide disparity in heights, as well as three different "strains" which have distinctive characteristics. I believe the height variation is something like anywhere from 2 foot 6 to over 4 feet (and able to ride a horse). Not to mention the legedary Meriadoc and Peregrin who came back from their adventure remarkably tall, thanks to Treebeard's water. There's a lot of room for variety there.

So of the 4 free races, it seems that it's Elves, the most "perfect", who have the least described variation (actually the least physical description, period). Why would dwarves have less variety than hobbits, and be as uniform as Elves? I understand that your mental picture requires it, but I'm not convinced that the text does.

Silverlode

"Of all faces those of our familiares are the ones both most difficult to play fantastic tricks with, and most difficult really to see with fresh attention. They have become like the things which once attracted us by their glitter, or their colour, or their shape, and we laid hands on them, and then locked them in our hoard, acquired them, and acquiring ceased to look at them.
Creative fantasy, because it is mainly trying to do something else [make something new], may open your hoard and let all the locked things fly away like cage-birds. The gems all turn into flowers or flames, and you will be warned that all you had (or knew) was dangerous and potent, not really effectively chained, free and wild; no more yours than they were you."
-On Fairy Stories


adu
Bree

Jul 8 2011, 9:41pm


Views: 1089
Nice...

Glad to know you like them. You dont see me much because I am one of those who read and observe more than comment :)

I actually am new to the site, in the sense I joined after hearing Hobbit was going to be made, that was 2007 I believe. The LOTR trilogy (my fav movie of all time) is the sole reason I became a movie fan, and after watching the movies I read The Hobbit for the first time, and it became my favorite book ever!

So anyways, I love what I have seen of the Hobbit so far. As you said, it's a team effort and I cant wait to see the final product.


kiwifan
Rohan

Jul 8 2011, 10:08pm


Views: 1105
They really do look perfect! I feel so relieved

because Oin and Gloin so exactly look as I have always pictured the Dwarves, even before seeing Gimli in LotR.

Maybe Nori is a hoax? (Wishful thinking on my part, I'm afraid...)

'Goodness gracious, you really are a messie!' 'Oh no, I'm not, these are all just mathoms...'


taekotemple
Grey Havens


Jul 9 2011, 2:31am


Views: 1037
Perhaps part of the issue is this

It's important when trying to make a point about someone's post, to post directly to them. By responding to my post about both Oden and my posts, it puts the burden of defending any point upon me, unless Oden read through the entire thread as well and chose to respond to you. The tone of your post sounded irritated, particularly moreso with me, so it came across as maybe being harsher than you intended.

Okay, given what you said, they've been living in the Blue Mountains. Fine. But in the story, they're travelling now. Whether they're technically homeless or not, they're on the road, and likely don't have access to amenities. That was more my point than anything else.


Oiotári
Tol Eressea


Jul 9 2011, 2:52am


Views: 1069
Yesterday

my reaction was something along the lines of "Dear Lord, would they really do this? Why does Nori look like he's addicted to hair gell? What's a Roman orator doing with a couple of dwarves?"

but now, seeing Oin and Gloin my faith in PJ is restored. I know now that all of the dwarves won't look like Nori and therefore I can appreciate him and the others in this batch


..The land of long-forgotten name:
......no man may ever anchor near;
..No steering star his hope may aim,
......for nether Night its marches drear,
..And waters wide no sail may tame,
......with shores encircled dark and sheer.

..O! Haven where my heart would be!
......the waves beat upon thy bar
..For ever echo endlessly,
......when longing leads thy thought afar


GafferBoffin
The Shire

Jul 9 2011, 5:22am


Views: 1093
What kind of dwarf writes graceful Elvish script?

I think this still perfectly captures the rare phenomenon of a nerdy, scholarly dwarf that has unaccountably gotten pulled into a gritty adventure. His expression is of exasperation and resignation - why can't I just study my lore? Maybe the allure of recovering lost chronicles of Erebor is the only reason he signed on to begin with. Kudos to PJ for taking each and every dwarf seriously.


DrDeath153
Lorien

Jul 9 2011, 10:44am


Views: 1027
Yeah

I think Ori is a good example where they've looked at the evidence and what little characterisation is available (in this case from the Moria sequence in the book) and extrapolated from it into a character couched in Tolkien's own writings. I suspected that Ori would be the scholar of the group, the 'Rifleman Harris' if you will and i'm glad that has been validated. It is far more satisfying for me to see that kind of development done than the kind of baseless flight of fancy approach they've taken with Nori. I have a great deal of affection for Jed Brophy and knew he was never going to be exactly the 'average' dwarf, but i would hate for him to become ill conceived hippy dealer of illicit substances. I think we've had enough of the 'pipe-weed' joke to be quite honest.

Ori isn't perfect though, i think i would have liked him to have a bit more dwarvishness to him, the discrete fawnish face-fuzz isn't sufficient to really sell him as a dwarf- i mean honestly, some hobbits grow more distinctive mutton-chops and so i think, particularly given Adam Brown's highly undwarvish look in person, they should have gone a bit further to disguise it, at least with a longer mustache (in fact hack the little braided bits from his beard and stick them on his top lip- that should do fine). At the moment he is looking very Nicholas Lyndhurst only with his lower lip packed with cotton wool as if he's doing a Don Vito Corleone impression.

Actually, if someone savvy with photoshop would be so kind- could you do the following adjustments: Shave off the points on Nori's hair and shift his head down a bit (say to the bottom of the first 'step' of hair visible to the right), stick Ori's beard braids on his top lip, and lower Dori's head down onto his shoulders too. I just want to see whether it's just a quirk of the angle and pose of them that makes their proportions look off (as well as adjusting a couple of details).

Dr Death


DrDeath153
Lorien

Jul 9 2011, 11:09am


Views: 997
The only way is up

I wouldn't say i'm being particularly rigid in this actually (first time for everything) i was happy that Frodo was as he appeared even without the rather nice Tolkienian justification. Because there was a lot of interbreeding of lines among Hobbits as well as among humans of different types there would be a fair amount of variation and sometimes a person who had characteristics indicative of say strong stoor blood but who didn't have any immediate stoor relatives would emerge from the genetic melting pot.

You seem to be implying however that variation is good, so long as it betters the average rather than worsens it. Elves may become taller than the average but not shorter (actually in Tolkien's early writings elves were depicted as being slightly shorter than humans along with their slender builds). High ranking men become more 'elven' with sharp noble features (the Gondorians for the record do not actually have Elvish blood- only the nobility of Dol Amroth were noted as such, and even then it was only a legend based on the legend of Amroth and Nimrodel. There was Elros, but i think his choice to become mortal kind of 'assimilated' his elvishness, and not all Numenoreans were descendants of the royal house and so simply had enhanced mannish physiology) but never more 'dwarven' with lumpy, rough-hewn features. That kind of 'good people have good looks' does have strong grounding in Tolkien who's description of the noble numenoreans is almost propagandic in it's prescriptiveness (something i have taken to calling the 'King and Country' interpretation of Numenor in reference to Blackadder's surmising of the magazine's depiction of the common British Tommy 'Six foot four with biceps the size of Bournemouth') but i think PJ should resist the urge to just make Middle-earth an aesthetic aristocracy where only the tall and attractive survive in noble houses. After all, if you look at say the British Royal Family, they're not exactly Britain's next top models. Prince William for example looked the spit of his mother as he grew into a fine figure of a young man, then you saw him at his wedding and good lord, what happened?! Chinless, thinning hair, George Bush's simian upper lip, hunched over, Charlie's DNA must have fought it's way through- the poor boy! Harry is their only hope of coming up with attractive royals any more- if rumours are to be believed, he's not got the curse of the Windsor looks....

Actually this entire diversion onto matters royal and matrimonial isn't a complete waste of time. Watching it i was actually thinking Harry could have been a good replacement for Rob Kazinsky, but far more than that, i think if Christopher Lee ever needed to drop out they've got the nearest vocal and physical double for him in Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Canterbury.

Dr Death


Elfhelm
The Shire

Jul 9 2011, 2:58pm


Views: 977
It just seems the pic was somehow manipulated/scaled to achieve more dwarvish proportions

As opposed to them looking like tall (human) men only in dwarven attire. The wigs, beards, the cut and design of the costumes etc. all add to the illusion of them having a more compact (dwarvish) build, but as dormouse pointed out their body proportions just don't seem quite right. I can understand them enhancing promotional still images in this way to ensure the end result looks convincing, but I guess in the film itself it would be much harder to do - and probably not even necessary.

Anyway, I was just wondering about what kind of photographic tricks were at play here, and as I said they look terrific, including the more traditional-looking Oin and Gloin!


Phibbus
Rohan


Jul 9 2011, 4:33pm


Views: 953
I posted this...

Over in the Oin/Gloin thread, but maybe I should have put it here...

The two dwarf pics are very close to one another in the aspect ratio of their dimensions, even though the one Nori/Ori/Dori has a greater camera distance from the subject to accommodate the additional figure. However, if you compare the backgrounds of the two, you'll find that they're very close to the same reveal in each photo.

The easiest way to compare the backgrounds is to copy each of the two pics into a folder and then flip back and forth between them in a slide show so that both are scaled to the same pixel height. As you alternate between the two, you'll note that there are shapes in the background that remain in a consistent position (especially on the right edge and at the upper-right corner.) The background does appear to be metamorphosing between the two—I'm not sure if it's a fog-wall or what exactly, and a sort of a crack-shape appears in that upper-right corner in the second one—but the pattern does remain consistent.

So anyway, Oin and Gloin, because the camera is closer to them, appear to rise to a much greater height against the background as compared to the previous trio. To me, this indicates that the actors were probably shot against an infinity green-screen and the background punched in without scaling it to match the zoom of the primary shot.

If it is, in fact, green-screening, it is very good green screening.



Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jul 9 2011, 6:11pm


Views: 951
Actually,no.

 

Quote
You seem to be implying however that variation is good, so long as it betters the average rather than worsens it.


I'm not trying to imply this at all. In fact, you appear to have completely missed my point.

I observed that those are the variations that Tolkien tends to point out. I don't think real world royal genetics have much to do with Middle-earth, because it's apparently Elvish ancestry as well as moral heritage which makes for beauty in Tolkien's men. The Elves are the "fairest and noblest" and so Men who have more Elvish strain in them display more of those characteristics. They also tend to be the ruling houses, so in Middle-earth nobility and beauty march together in a way they rarely do in the real world.

My point is that there is the least variation described among those who are supposedly most perfect, and that all the other races show a great deal of variety. Therefore, I deduce that dwarves may also be reasonably expected to have variation among type. Dwarves will be, in general terms, taller than hobbits and shorter than men, and bearded. They tend to be stockier in build than hobbits, but we are not told if that means that they are as broad as men or somewhere in between. And even if that is the mean, there will always be those who deviate from it in some way. In fact, we do have an unusually fat dwarf in Bombur. Why can't there be an unusually slender dwarf also? Or an unusually tall, unusually short, or beautiful, or ugly...I don't see any reason to expect dwarves to be more uniform than other races, and I certainly do not expect them to be as uniform as Elves. I don't think any of the dwarves we've been shown so far deviate so far from the mean as to be un-dwarvish.

Silverlode

"Of all faces those of our familiares are the ones both most difficult to play fantastic tricks with, and most difficult really to see with fresh attention. They have become like the things which once attracted us by their glitter, or their colour, or their shape, and we laid hands on them, and then locked them in our hoard, acquired them, and acquiring ceased to look at them.
Creative fantasy, because it is mainly trying to do something else [make something new], may open your hoard and let all the locked things fly away like cage-birds. The gems all turn into flowers or flames, and you will be warned that all you had (or knew) was dangerous and potent, not really effectively chained, free and wild; no more yours than they were you."
-On Fairy Stories


willowing
Lorien

Jul 10 2011, 7:52am


Views: 902
Dori, Ori and Nori...

Oh my! Does this mean that these dwarves are going to set a fashion trend for winter? The costumes are beautifully put together and if you look close enough you can see the detailing. On top of that a wide array of accessories like belts, hats, weapons, scarves.

Dori does so look like a distinguished gentleman with his silver gray hair and a very devoted brother. Cool


Gandalf'sMother
Rohan

Jul 11 2011, 1:38am


Views: 930
Ori

May look better with just a longer "Fu Manchu" beard. The top lip can stay bare. Note that Alan Lee depicts certain dwarves with no hair on their top lips, but very long beards.


DrDeath153
Lorien

Jul 11 2011, 8:01am


Views: 877
Very true

But a longer beard tends to denote age, so while i wouldn't mind another dwarf without a mustache and a long beard (you could argue Dori is a bit that way himself, given that his two strands of 'tache come from behind his nostrils rather than stating joined at the top at the philtrum) Ori i think works with a shorter beard, he just needs something a bit more respectable than the 'fuzz' clinging to his upper lip.

Dr Death


Bladerunner
Gondor

Jul 13 2011, 4:26pm


Views: 871
Dori - The Most Interesting Dwarf in the World

Dori's hair is likely much longer than it appears because it is probably tied into a long pony tail that is not visible from the front view.

BTW - for some reason Dori reminds me of the "Most Intersting Man in the World" commercial.
i.e. - "I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis"....


marillaraina
Rohan

Jul 13 2011, 7:56pm


Views: 822
OMG


In Reply To
Dori's hair is likely much longer than it appears because it is probably tied into a long pony tail that is not visible from the front view.

BTW - for some reason Dori reminds me of the "Most Intersting Man in the World" commercial.
i.e. - "I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis"....


You're RIGHT!

ROFL

Now I can't get pictures of Dori playing Jai Alai and taming lions out of my head. :) With a beautiful woman on each arm of course.


Bladerunner
Gondor

Jul 13 2011, 10:46pm


Views: 792
Or shown fighting dragons and spiders :0)....

Dori may have a lucrative career as a celebrity spokesperson.

As for commercial opportunities for the rest of the dwarves... - "What's in Your Wallet!?".....


marillaraina
Rohan

Jul 14 2011, 5:09am


Views: 1741
Oh this could be fun...


In Reply To
Dori may have a lucrative career as a celebrity spokesperson.

As for commercial opportunities for the rest of the dwarves... - "What's in Your Wallet!?".....


I wish I had a better imagination because now I want to imagine all the spokesperson opportunities for the 13 dwarves. Well I guess Kili would be a natural for Pantene("Don't hate me because I'm beautiful") comes with his own wind machine. Bifur, Bofur and Bombur could make a great blue collar beer commercial - Maybe they could be "real men of genius". :)


(This post was edited by marillaraina on Jul 14 2011, 5:09am)