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GDT Talks Hobbit and Spoilers


Jun 5 2008, 11:29am

Views: 1280
GDT Talks Hobbit and Spoilers

Spoiler has posted an article addressing the prevalence of spoilers on the internet, and Guillermo del Toro chimes with a comment about the upcoming 'Hobbit:'

"Pan's Labyrinth director Guillermo del Toro plans on being pretty transparent as he embarks on The Hobbit. "It's easier to protect the 20 percent of a project that's really sensitive if you're open about the other 80 percent," he says. "I think that's the way to go, especially with a project like The Hobbit, which is a holy book for so many people. People should know the path you're walking.""

A quick note about and spoilers (if you are new hear) - we do post them but give you ample warning to choose not to read them. Please read the full article at Thanks to Silverlode for the heads up on this story. [Read More]

The Mysterious Calisuri


Jun 5 2008, 12:41pm

Views: 777
THe Hobbit is not a holy book.

I hope GDT isn't scared to modify the book, especially when its silliness touches the 10th degree on the 10th degree ISS (International Scale of Silliness), and that happens quite often.
He should just do a great movie, and not bow to the text.
Thank you

(This post was edited by Altaira on Jun 6 2008, 5:45pm)


Jun 5 2008, 12:50pm

Views: 719
Humm humm...

Not too sure what to think of this actually. I like transparent in a "react to rumors here and there on this massage board"-kind of way. But protect 20% by being open about the other 80% sounds a bit too easy to me.

I think PJ did the same thing on King Kong: he spoiled us with production diaries about pretty much everything, while keeping the designs for King Kong and dino's to himself. I predict the same thing happening on The Hobbit, with secrecy about Smaug and the spiders for instance, and too much info about other things... I don't want to be visually spoiled by production diaries or a constant flow of pictures or whatnot.

I'd much rather have him be secret about 90% while we break our brains over gossip, rumor and spy reports. Its much more fun. Production diaries (if they are even going to do them, but for arguments sake lets assume they will), though interesting give me a misguided sense of involvement and will loose none of their charm or interestingness (is that even a word?) if they are released on dvd after the movie comes out.

(But it is nice of him to share, and recognise that the book is loved by so many!)


Jun 5 2008, 12:56pm

Views: 754
No offense but...

xxxyyy, we are all entitled to our opinions, but it seems somehow disrespectful to call TH "silly" etc, in addition to comments from your other posts on the subject, like the book feeling like it was written by a 12 year old for 4 year olds (sorry if I misquoted). If you don't like the book, fine, but the majority of us here do. It is first and foremost a book published for children in 1937. To many of us it is greatly entertaining and highly enjoyable. Since it comes across less of an opinion in your posts and more of a statement, I felt I had to say something in return.

To me TH is not a holy book, but it isn't something cheap and silly either. There is a great story within the pages and while some material may not match up with the more serious tone of LOTR, that is largely where the book gets its charm. The tone should not be completely overlooked by GDT and others and should be kept in mind when approaching the story's realization onto film. The tone of the book needs to be respected for it to be a worthy adaptation.


Jun 5 2008, 12:58pm

Views: 723
How much will you keep up on?

So do you have to know it all when it is released? Or do you pick and choose on what spoilers you read, or do you try to avoid them all? I know I pick and choose because I want the movie to be a surprise for me for the most part, but I do read some of the spoilers. I also think for me that by pick and choosing I can keep the experience relatively new for me since I'm not in the process of making it. Those spoilers fascinate me, the ones about how making the movie or a part of the movie by someone involved is interesting to me. So grateful that the OneRing has always posted spoiler warnings. I wonder when an official countdown to the opening release will come up (I know we need an actual date, but a tenative countdown).

" . . . (we are ) too engrossed in thinking of everything as a preparation or training or making one fit -- for what? At any minute it is what we are and are doing, not what we plan to be and do that counts."

J.R.R. Tolkien in his 6 October 1940 letter to his son Michael Tolkien.


Jun 5 2008, 1:26pm

Views: 699
Don't be scared

It seems to me that we're getting scared for every piece of news we get. We're talking about accomplished filmmakers here, they know what to show you and what not to show you. Besides, the topic of spoilers in the case of The Hobbit, at least for us fans of the book, is pretty straightforward. We all know how it begins, we all know what happens in the middle, and we all know how it ends, so as long as they don't show every design concept or every expanded scene, it'll be ok.

If you don't want to be spoiled, you just don't watch production diaries, the art design gallery, GdT's notebook, etc, it's as simple as that. For example, Hellboy's official site is full of material that some may consider spoilerish but, in my case, that's what really got me excited about the movie. So, it depends on every person and what that person wants to see. I mean, I remember when Harry Potter was about to come out (the 7th one). I basically didn't watch TV, didn't visit any web pages, didn't read any reviews, and when I finally bought the book, I had no idea what was going to happen. The same applies to every material, the decision "to be spoiled or not to be" is yours...Wink

Please, give us back Glorfindel!!!


Jun 5 2008, 1:38pm

Views: 653
Hear hear! //



Jun 5 2008, 2:00pm

Views: 672
Depends where it is coming from.

I read everything I could find when LOTR was being made. Every article, every spy report, every rumour, every picture. And I kind of had to, being part of TORn's associate editors.

But it was different, because it came from 'third-party sources'. We never knew if it was true, for instance. And they were mostly written reports, and they tickled your imagination. Although I do regret looking at some of the pictures. The early shots from Gollum, Edoras etc. Those things are better saved for the big screen, but I have no illusions about being able to do that. Filmtrailers nowadays spoil almost everything.

I lasted about seven production diaries on King Kong, after that I couldn't really be bothered to view them anymore. Or I only did so when I was bored.

I stell prefer reading written reports (for instance, I devour any set reports or behind the scenes-stuff written on AICN, not because it is so well written, but because I like the enthusiasm and I like that I can set my imagination loose on it) and I hope we will get a lot of spy reports on The Hobbit.

Ignorance is bliss, but a little teaser every now and then will get me through the wait ;-)

Tol Eressea

Jun 5 2008, 2:10pm

Views: 712
Is is a 'spoiler' if you've read the book?

Personally, I tend to only be adverse to spoilers when it's a film I don't know anything about, like the newest 'Indiana Jones' film. I don't mind finding out details about movies like 'The Hobbit' or 'The Chronicles of Narnia' - stories I already know. I know that there is a lot that can get changed or left out from the books (as well all know!), but although I don't actively seek out information, i'm not too bothered when I find something out either.

Having said all of that, I think it's smart of GDT to be open about certain aspects of 'The Hobbit', just as PJ was about 'King Kong' when did the production diaries - a tactic that i've noticed more and more directors using in the last few years.

"...and back again."


Jun 5 2008, 2:37pm

Views: 675
Peter did the same thing with LotR

The players of the film didn't even have all of the information and were caught by surprises themselves!

I sniggered when you said reading the book was a spoiler. WAY FERSHER!

I want to have spoilers available for me to look at or not; but I definitely don't want to know everything and am so geeked about the surprises and looks of those iconic characters and beasts! Oh yeah, every crumb off the table will keep me busy and wanting/waiting for more!! *twitch*

sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."

TORn's Observations Lists


Jun 5 2008, 4:50pm

Views: 629

with you, its much more fun having the anticipations about the unknown..what we dont know gives rise to among others, this discussion board on torn...:) the hobbit and the rings are social phenomenon as well as just films, or books. Its the whole package that makes tolkiens world so great..sharing of opinions and references.


Jun 5 2008, 4:57pm

Views: 680
No offence at all, we have different points of view.

and I have to say that, compared to LOTR, "The Hobbit" is... not worth the time spent reading it. Sorry if I'm so disrespectful with it, but I deeply didn't like it AT ALL.
C'mon... holy book... I hope the tone is that of LOTR, book and movie, especially movie, because this is where the comparisons will be made. I can understand TH is the first book Tolkien wrote, and that he gave it this childish tone, I'm fine with it. I guess I would have appreciated it if had read it when I was a child, but I read it after LOTR, and I'd rather not have the same experience with the movie.
Another big problem I have with The Hobbit is that it seems to be a "short" version of LOTR. I'm sure this connection has already been done thousands of time. It's basically the same story... the same structure... and coupled with this childish tone... I have to say that, if they want to be faithful to the book, to the Holiness of the book... and not make some serious changes (changes much deeper than those made by PJ and Co.) to the story and the tone... I'm worried.
I hope GDT will make a movie that will please the movie goers, not the book readers.

(This post was edited by xxxyyy on Jun 5 2008, 4:59pm)

N.E. Brigand

Jun 5 2008, 5:16pm

Views: 650
"The Hobbit" is not "the first book Tolkien wrote".

His first published book was A Middle English Vocabulary (1922), and the first book he wrote (which he abandoned unfinished but which is substantial nonetheless) was The Book of Lost Tales (written c. 1916-1920, published in two volumes 1983-1984 as edited by Christopher Tolkien).

We're discussing The Lord of the Rings in the Reading Room, Oct. 15, 2007 - Mar. 22, 2009!

Join us Jun. 2-8 for "Flotsam and Jetsam".


Jun 5 2008, 9:41pm

Views: 595
I think

I agree about the 90%. Prince Caspian isn't released here till the end of the month and I have already worn myself and the film out by reading up on it an searching out pictures etc.. It would be incredibly tempting to do the same with The Hobbit (though I'm not sure I will survive three years of this!!!), but in the end I think I want to be blown away at the cinema after three years of the gossip and rumours...definitely more fun.

Interestingly on the BBC website today they announced that James McAvoy might be Bilbo. I chuckled to myself thinking what "old" news that was Laugh, I'm so very thankful for TORN. I too am glad that GDT acknowledges how loved The Hobbit should keep him on his toes!



Jun 5 2008, 10:02pm

Views: 631
My last words

I mean... not my last words in general, but on this topic.
We have two inconsistent book, in tone, and let me add, in quality, let's not have two inconsistent movies.
(Ok, someone would say The Hobbit has the same quality of LOTR because it's book for children. So, let's make a children movie, totally inconsistent with LOTR movie, let's make a Disney movie.)


Jun 5 2008, 10:29pm

Views: 588

It is not childlike all the way through, it darkens considerably as it progresses. GDT has already said he is going to be following this sort of an angle through the movie, but he has made it fairly clear its going to be a little darker than the book. So I would not worry too much.


Jun 5 2008, 10:36pm

Views: 601
Why not please both groups?

Why one over the other? Why not make a movie that will please both average movie goers and long-time fans of the book? They managed to do so with LotR, why not with The Hobbit? Sure, you can't please everyone, but they came pretty close with LotR. And I'll bet they do with The Hobbit, as well.

In Reply To
I hope GDT will make a movie that will please the movie goers, not the book readers.

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -Dr. Seuss (Theodor Geisel)

Believe in the possibility of the impossible.

Daughter of Nienna
Grey Havens

Jun 6 2008, 1:24am

Views: 580
The Hobbit is not all

this or that. It is certainly not all silly, only some places may be.

After reading The Hobbit in a book discussion series here at TORn in the Reading Room (RR) with other adults, I learned a lot about what the Hobbit is, what it isn't, what the sources are, etc. I learned just how adult it really is. Much more than one would pick up on first reading. It also has helped me to read books about Tolkien and his works, and about Mythology and Fearie and the history of story to see more of what is there.

The Hobbit is generally classified as a children's book, but the sources come from a deep cauldron of story ages full of ingredients and tradition, It is my feeling that there is a lot more than there than you have allowed yourself to see and experience,

That is not to say I don't get what your experience is having read it after LotR, I imagine it was a let down if you expected something the same. I, myself, don't quit get nearly the experience from it I get from LotR. I am sure there are a lot of people who feel similarly. However, I appreciate it a lot more than before, and I am super excited about the film being made.

I trust GDT will do it justice while simultaneously finding balance between what you call 'silly' and what he calls 'darker'. He knows a great deal about Mythology, Fairy tales, Fearie and Heroic Tales and based on his films & varous comments, I believe he will bring to the table a great level a depth as well.

"Some relavant & enlightening LINKs" — a post I made 4/26 (links from hsi website going in to depth of what I just said about what GDT knows, from his website & other sources):;#92076

As a suggestion...
The next time there is a book discussion on The Hobbit in the Reading Room, join in... or at least lurk. You might be surprised by what you discover. There is bound to be such a discussion as we draw closer to the film.


**Tribute: Lt. J.G. Robert Sterling, WWII Pilot MIA, by Gramma & DoN**
Art Gallery Revised, Aloha & Mahalo, Websites Directory

Nienna: “ those who hearken to her learn pity, and endurance in hope . . . All those who wait in Mandos cry to her, for she brings strength to the spirit and turns sorrow to wisdom." — Valaquenta


Jun 6 2008, 4:33am

Views: 575
PLEASE no Production Diaries

For many reasons, but this is one of the more subtler but in the end more important ones, IMO.

With a documentary-style piece (something that you can tell was filmed on set, a documentary camera capturing "over the shoulder" as a film is being made, you put on the Extended DVD Appendices 5 yrs later, you feel a genuine sense of "being there" witnessing that proverbial lightening being captured in the bottle, witnessing history in the making. This sense of the viewer being a "third party that just happened to sneak in and be granted access" is what keeps me coming back to view them again and again and if I were a film student...! . You do get the sense that you are a fly on the wall and party to a historic process as it unfolded.

A Production Diary, on the other hand, quickly grows stale b/c there is nothing SPONTANEOUS about it. As much as set access as you get, you never feel you are part of the filming process; instead just the opposite: you feel excluded b/c what is being shown to you was PRE-PACKAGED for you. If you were a film student, this would be the Orientation video, with all the excitement those have. While, of course, the really juicy stuff is happening in another building. With the full assembly of cast, camera-people, gaffers, grips, and assorted hangers-on, told to silence their cell phones now, we are filming, please. The huge crowds of people on any given day on any given set for LOTR, indoor or outdoors, and we see this in every frame of the Appendices. I'ts why I treasure them so much.

Oh and one more thing: let me add my voice to the "please, as little spoilers as possible, I don't care about the 80%" camp. Mr.Del Toro, we respect your wish not to keep the fans in the dark, and we know you are very interactive with your fans, but some of us do like secrets!

(This post was edited by Sunflower on Jun 6 2008, 4:42am)


Jun 6 2008, 8:11am

Views: 568
Don't know if I'm in the minority here or not

but as much as I love Smaug, I don't want to see his image on the net before I've had the chance to see him in his FULL scariness on the big screen. So that's one spoiler I'll definitely be avoiding like the plague.

About all I'm looking forward to is hearing is who will play who, but then I don't really consider that to be a spoiler, it just adds to the anticipation.

There he stood
Proud and solemn
Yet happy and gay
Kelvarhin's Universe
In the land of TORnadoes...where the brilliant play (with thanks to grammaboodawg :) )

Daughter of Nienna
Grey Havens

Jun 7 2008, 9:02am

Views: 518
Are you sure you meant . . .

to reply to me?

**Tribute: Lt. J.G. Robert Sterling, WWII Pilot MIA, by Gramma & DoN**
Art Gallery Revised, Aloha & Mahalo, Websites Directory

Nienna: “ those who hearken to her learn pity, and endurance in hope . . . All those who wait in Mandos cry to her, for she brings strength to the spirit and turns sorrow to wisdom." — Valaquenta