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Kim
Valinor
Nov 18 2013, 6:13am
Post #76 of 99
(475 views)
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Isn't there something similar in England?
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Like if you ask someone if they like their food and they respond "it's quite nice", that actually means, "it's awful, but I'm too polite to say so." I seem to remember hearing that somewhere.
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Starling
Half-elven
Nov 18 2013, 6:18am
Post #77 of 99
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It's our national accent I think. Some of us have a stronger Zild than others I suppose. I know mine is much stronger than it used to be.
For a long time many New Zealanders didn't want to sound the way we do - 'cultural cringe'.
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Kim
Valinor
Nov 18 2013, 6:57am
Post #78 of 99
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There was a thread a couple of months ago where you and Kelvarhin were discussing the differences between New Zild and 'Strine (http://newboards.theonering.net/..._string=zild;#638258) and I guess I thought it was more about the words used than the accent.
And no need for a cultural cringe, I love the New Zealand accent! 
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Starling
Half-elven
Nov 18 2013, 7:32am
Post #79 of 99
(490 views)
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I have been desperate for an excuse to post this
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It's not totally relevant to the conversation, but it makes me weak with laughter every time I see it.
Let's invade New Zealand! And an Aussie take on the '100% NZ Pure' campaign.
We give each other heaps, but we love each other really. 
We have many similarities in our language, although we sound very different (to our own ears, at least).
Just ask an Aussie and a Kiwi to say 'six'. 
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Eledhwen
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Nov 18 2013, 7:59am
Post #80 of 99
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In received pronunciation perhaps (ie BBC English, or what the Queen speaks) but a lot of regional accents are very badly enunciated.
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The Grey Elf
Grey Havens
Nov 18 2013, 2:02pm
Post #81 of 99
(445 views)
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That cracked me up!!
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Werde Spinner
Rohan
Nov 18 2013, 3:23pm
Post #83 of 99
(446 views)
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Some people will get offended even down here.
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However, it seems to be mostly my generation. For me, it's automatic to say, "Yes, ma'am," and, "Yes, sir," to a cashier, and so once when I did that to a girl no older than me, she didn't like that very much... Oops. 
On the other hand, the first time I was called 'ma'am' was by some random guy outside the grocery store who was apologizing for almost running in to me. I was only 16 and wondered if I should be offended or not. Finally, I figured that it was just an automatic response on his part and decided to be pleased with his politeness instead of being offended.
It's also hard for me to call adults in my parish or elsewhere by their first names. I tend to use 'Mr.' and 'Mrs.' with their names. Sometimes I use them with their last names, although in the kind of small community where I live there are so many people with the same last name that you really need to differentiate with the first name. None of them have seemed offended yet...
"I had forgotten that. It is hard to be sure of anything among so many marvels. The world is all grown strange. Elf and Dwarf in company walk in our daily fields; and folk speak with the Lady of the Wood and yet live; and the Sword comes back to war that was broken in the long ages ere the fathers of our fathers rode into the Mark! How shall a man judge what to do in such times?"
"As he ever has judged. Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house."
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Werde Spinner
Rohan
Nov 18 2013, 3:28pm
Post #84 of 99
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but around here I always hear that one used genuinely. Huh. At least, that's how my family uses it; even I use it that way. Sort of in the context of someone with a sick or dying family member, "Bless her heart, she has so much on her plate right now and to have this happen to her on top of all that," or, about a sick child, "Bless his little heart, but he looked so miserable, I just wanted to tell him, 'Honey, go lay down on the couch and take a nap'." That sort of thing.
I'm so used to hearing it used that way that it would probably take me a few moments to detect the sarcasm if I ever heard it being used snarkily!
"I had forgotten that. It is hard to be sure of anything among so many marvels. The world is all grown strange. Elf and Dwarf in company walk in our daily fields; and folk speak with the Lady of the Wood and yet live; and the Sword comes back to war that was broken in the long ages ere the fathers of our fathers rode into the Mark! How shall a man judge what to do in such times?"
"As he ever has judged. Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house."
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Werde Spinner
Rohan
Nov 18 2013, 3:32pm
Post #85 of 99
(457 views)
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Oooh, I have the same reaction!
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I can't stand being called a Yank! However, people from overseas just don't understand the important distinction and so we must be patient with them... 
It's funny how, being southern, there's always been this disconnect for me when some British people call all Americans "Yanks". I hear them say that and I immediately think "I'm not a Yank! I'm from the South! Oh, wait a minute..."
"I had forgotten that. It is hard to be sure of anything among so many marvels. The world is all grown strange. Elf and Dwarf in company walk in our daily fields; and folk speak with the Lady of the Wood and yet live; and the Sword comes back to war that was broken in the long ages ere the fathers of our fathers rode into the Mark! How shall a man judge what to do in such times?"
"As he ever has judged. Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house."
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Na Vedui
Rohan
Nov 18 2013, 5:15pm
Post #86 of 99
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as in "all gone"? If so, it may be from German, where "alle" means just that. I've noticed before (as a Brit who's studied German) that one or two things I find odd in US usage remind me of German phrases and meanings. Were there settlers from Germany in your neck of the woods?
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Ataahua
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Nov 18 2013, 6:19pm
Post #87 of 99
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During the last Olympics I was joking with an Aussie friend that the reason we were cleaning up in the rowing is because they double as our navy. 
Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."
"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.
Ataahua's stories
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Eowyn of Penns Woods
Valinor
Nov 18 2013, 6:28pm
Post #88 of 99
(446 views)
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Yes, we're all about half German/German-Swiss here!
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The Scots, Irish, and Scots-Irish half contributed its own share of linguistic quirks here, but the final wave of Germanic immigrants usually tried to assimilate very quickly (nobody wanted to be "Dumb Deutsch"). Dad does remember his mother talking about one very elderly female relative, though, who still absolutely refused to speak anything but German at home, so this one may be due to her influence. =)
**********************************
NABOUF
Not a TORns*b!
Certified Curmudgeon
Knitting Knerd
NARF: NWtS Chapter Member since June 17,2011
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Kim
Valinor
Nov 18 2013, 6:57pm
Post #89 of 99
(416 views)
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that's hilarious! (I mean that's terrible, just terrible).
Well, based on Roheryn's story about her horse, I can guess how a Kiwi says "six". And one of my co-workers is an Aussie, I'll have to listen closely next time she says "six", but I think I can make a guess. 
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elaen32
Gondor
Nov 18 2013, 10:14pm
Post #90 of 99
(404 views)
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about being called "love" in a patronising manner by men. Also "darling" as in "Listen, darlin', you just do as I say" Love your response here Ataahua!! I suppose all these endearments are so delivery and situation dependent. If one of my elderly patients calls me "love" or "dear" I don't take it amiss at all. But if a male nearer my age says the same in an aggressive or sarcastic manner, it is not quite the same.
Another popular "nice" endearment in the English Midlands is "duck" or "ducky" (the u is usually pronounced as oo as in book, rather than u as in bug)
Is there a Tolkien topic that you have wanted to look into more deeply and write about your thoughts on it? If so, we'd like to hear from you for the next TORn Amateur Symposium- coming in November. Happy writing!
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Lily Fairbairn
Half-elven
Nov 18 2013, 10:23pm
Post #91 of 99
(415 views)
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It just goes to show you that the people who think enunciation equals British accent have a very limited experience of British accents.
OTOH, last summer a drunken Scot on a ferry from Orkney was hanging on my every word---he said he'd never heard a "real" (by which I suppose he meant "not on TV") American accent before. Nothing like a comment like that to make me cringingly aware of every vowel sound coming out of my mouth!
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Maciliel
Valinor
Nov 19 2013, 1:37am
Post #92 of 99
(401 views)
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...the New Jersey accent! Especially when it is accompanied by a nasally voice. Has anyone here watched Cake Boss and heard Buddy Valastro's (spelling?) sisters (especially Mary and Grace) yell at each other? That drives me nuts! I don't think I could handle working in that bakery and having to hear them talk like that all the time! I think all the Valastro's are wonderful, kind people but I just can't stand the accent!
that particular accent is all over the media.... but very few people in the state, percentage-wise, talk like that.
nj is one of the smallest states, but one of the greatest varieties of accents.
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aka. fili orc-enshield
+++++++++++++++++++
the scene, as i understand it, is exceptionally well-written. fili (in sort of a callback to the scene with the eagles), calls out "thorRIIIIIIN!!!" just as he sees the pale orc veer in for the kill. he picks up the severed arm of an orc which is lying on the ground, swings it up in desperation, effectively blocking the pale orc's blow. and thus, forever after, fili is known as "fili orc-enshield."
this earns him deep respect from his hard-to-please uncle. as well as a hug. kili wipes his boots on the pale orc's glory box. -- maciliel telpemairo
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Werde Spinner
Rohan
Nov 19 2013, 4:07pm
Post #93 of 99
(385 views)
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Notice how so many German immigrants dropped the final 'n' off of their names so they wouldn't sound so 'Deutsch': Beckmann became Beckman, Zuckermann became Zuckerman, and so forth. Most of the pronunciations are still intact, though, oddly enough. Very few of the older generation around here can remember more than a smattering of German, even my grandfather, and he can remember saying his prayers in German every morning. As a matter of fact, when his older sisters started school they didn't know a word of English. Now, however, they can't remember much at all... We assimilated too thoroughly, it seems. 
It's interesting to note, though, how many similarities there still are between the way we speak English and some German idioms. Language is such a fascinating thing, isn't it?
"I had forgotten that. It is hard to be sure of anything among so many marvels. The world is all grown strange. Elf and Dwarf in company walk in our daily fields; and folk speak with the Lady of the Wood and yet live; and the Sword comes back to war that was broken in the long ages ere the fathers of our fathers rode into the Mark! How shall a man judge what to do in such times?"
"As he ever has judged. Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house."
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Rembrethil
Tol Eressea
Nov 19 2013, 5:32pm
Post #94 of 99
(375 views)
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But I do realise a more sarcastic attitude does prevail in these parts. Nothing consciously intended to be rude, just how we are. I visited in the South with some friends, and, for the first two weeks, the locals thought we were all enemies!! We just joke a lot more, so it sounds like we are fighting.
Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!
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The Grey Elf
Grey Havens
Nov 19 2013, 5:44pm
Post #95 of 99
(357 views)
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Something like Brits who enjoy "taking the piss" out if each other ;-) //
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Welcome more children to Middle Earth. Support The S.H.I.R.E. Project!
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The Grey Elf
Grey Havens
Nov 19 2013, 5:55pm
Post #96 of 99
(358 views)
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I remember hearing somewhere, perhaps after a census
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(Though one from some time ago) that historically, Germans made up the largest group of immigrants into the US. So it stands to reason the influence of the language would be widespread.
My paternal gran was German -- maiden name was Reichenbach -- and the only German word I remember her using was "sputzi" for sparrow which I believe is not uncommonly used in the SW of Pennsylvania, at least among the older generations. The most German aspect if her to me was her cooking, heavy with onions, bacon, cabbage. Interesting how our inherited cultures are also passed on not just through language, but also preferred foods.
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sherlock
Gondor
Nov 19 2013, 6:13pm
Post #97 of 99
(343 views)
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Annapolis but have never used Hon. I've heard it a lot, though. I don't know about my accent but Annapolis is considered an unfriendly place by outsiders. A guy I work with always teases me about being a snooty Annapolitan, which I'm not.
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Rembrethil
Tol Eressea
Nov 19 2013, 7:50pm
Post #99 of 99
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There are a lot of localities with a cultural majority. I live in a very Italian dominated city, and every third name in the directory ends in 'o', 'a', or 'i'. I have never met anyone that speaks with the 'Joisy' accent. I think it is more of a NY thing. People disbelieve me when I tell them where I am from.
Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!
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Thanks for sharing
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