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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Greenbooks guest post: in defense of a Hobbit trilogy
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DanielLB
Immortal


Aug 6 2012, 7:32am

Post #101 of 112 (364 views)
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It's more real [In reply to] Can't Post

than the love between Gandalf and Galadriel.

We don't know much more than that - it could be unrequited.

I wouldn't worry though, they're not going to have any "alone time". Kili's locked up in Thranduil's Halls, and then dies at the end. We're not going to get a Middle-earth wedding. It could work nicely, as well, if similar to Gimli and Galadriel.

Welcome to TORn TheBeerBaron Smile


TheBeerBaron
Rivendell

Aug 6 2012, 7:35am

Post #102 of 112 (362 views)
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Thanks DLB [In reply to] Can't Post

and I think that you're probably correct.


innoce77
Registered User

Aug 6 2012, 8:33am

Post #103 of 112 (387 views)
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Tauriel and Bard [In reply to] Can't Post

First Post - I absolutely agree with your theory on Tauriel and Bard. (Beren and Luthien, you read my mind) As you mentioned to insert a romance in a major way, the two characters should be in the first film and i thought exactly as you said. They(Bard and Tauriel) will be present in the Mirkwood. I think Kill will have a crush on Tauriel but that's it. PJ loves love triangle and I smell Bard-Tauriel-Kill angle a little bit. I think bard will be a widower. It's too much like Aragorn - Arwen but I want to see how this plays out if this really happens.

Who's Tauriel's love interest?
Major love story needs major character - I think 4 major characters in the Hobbit are Bilbo, Thorin, Gandalf and Bard. (Sauron???)
Bard is the most suitable choice for Romantic lead.

I've been lurking on this board for 5months, have learned awful a lot about Middle earth history and Characters.
I'd never heard about Lord of the rings before PJ movies and It was Aragorn and Arwen's love story made me fall in love with this fantasy world.
I normally don't like cheesy romance in movies but Aragorn and Arwen's felt different and I want another love story in the Hobbit as well.(Although I didn't notice the fact there's no Female in the Hobbit while reading it)
I know most of the members on this board hates romance idea, but there are people like me.


(This post was edited by innoce77 on Aug 6 2012, 8:36am)


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Aug 6 2012, 2:20pm

Post #104 of 112 (377 views)
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Prophecy appears in several places, most notably from Gandalf and Glorfindel, actually [In reply to] Can't Post

"Help will come from the hands of the small when The Wise falter," was said before Bilbo's birth and a century or more before The Quest for Erebor.

And, of course, there is Glorfindel's famous prophecy and foresight regarding The Witch-King.

Also there is the dream of Faramir and Boromir "In Imladris it dwells. There shall be counsels taken, stronger than Morgul Spells. . . a sign . . . that doom is near at hand, for Isildur's Bane shall waken, and The Halfing forth shall stand."

And then there is the matter of The Seeing Stones, which "Do not lie, and even The Lord of Barad-Dur cannot make them do so."

In Reply To

Unfortunately 'Prophecy' as a device does not feature much in Tolkien's writings - IMHO the closest we get to it in LotR is the Mirror of Galadriel, while Elrond's many visions of the possible future most of which showed Sauron's victory and Arwen/Aragorn unconsummated are a PJ addition .


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."

(This post was edited by AinurOlorin on Aug 6 2012, 2:22pm)


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Aug 6 2012, 3:27pm

Post #105 of 112 (335 views)
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Highly improbable [In reply to] Can't Post

That he would outright lie about how his character was expanded "in jest."

No, we will get a brief unrequited love story, I imagine.


Kassandros
Rohan


Aug 6 2012, 4:35pm

Post #106 of 112 (345 views)
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Why Gandalf chose Bilbo *SPOILER - COMIC CON FOOTAGE* [In reply to] Can't Post

I haven't seen the Comic Con footage myself, but from the descriptions I've read, the scene between Galadriel and Gandalf in Rivendell involves Galadriel asking why Gandalf decided to include a hobbit.

Here's a description:

- THIRD SCENE: The ethereally beautiful Galadriel (Cate Blanchett) wants to know why Gandalf the Grey choose “the halfling” for this most difficult of journeys. Unlike fellow wizard Saruman who believes in power above all, Gandalf believes “it is the small things, every act of normal folk that keeps the darkness of at bay — simple acts of kindness and love.” He continues: “Why Bilbo Baggins? Perhaps it is because I am afraid, and he gives me courage.” Galadriel steps forward and takes ahold of Gandalf’s hand, saying that if has ever any need of her, he only has to ask and she will be there. It’s quite a touching and emotional moment that hints at something deeper between the two, particularly on the part of the wizard.

from http://thorinoakenshield.net/...tage-from-comic-con/

So yes, this will be covered.

all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us...


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Aug 6 2012, 5:16pm

Post #107 of 112 (329 views)
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Welcome out of lurkerdom innoce77 [In reply to] Can't Post

What Thorin, Bilbo, and Gandalf have on their plates already tells me they are not candidates for a romance sub plot. Adding a romantic interest to their arcs would distract us over much from the rich story elements built into their characters already. That they beefed up the romance aspect of Aragorn in LOTR was foregivable since at least it was part of his story in the books.

Kili and Bard however both have room for such a thing especially as, at least in the case of Bard it's clear, they have expanded their roles. What better (or perhaps more convenient) way to flesh out a character?

For my part, I like PJ and co's approach to romance (ie in LOTR and King Kong); it is not so much cheesy, as it is not overtly sexual or gratuitous. It is in his approach to romance that PJ is most courageous as a film maker, especially in an industry that seems hardly to know the difference between sex and romance.


(This post was edited by SirDennisC on Aug 6 2012, 5:17pm)


Black Breathalizer
Rohan


Aug 6 2012, 8:24pm

Post #108 of 112 (312 views)
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Divinely inspired [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't think there's any need whatsoever to 'explain' why Gandalf decides to choose Bilbo. Instead of coming up with some hokey prophecy to explain it way, I think it's better for the audience to simply sense that Gandalf is the hand of providence. The old wizard doesn't know why he chooses Bilbo, he only knows he must.

It ties in beautifully with his later comment in FOTR, that "Bilbo was meant to find the ring."


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Aug 6 2012, 11:11pm

Post #109 of 112 (276 views)
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Amen [In reply to] Can't Post

I really do despise this Lucasian need to explain away everything mysterious with some awfully unsatisfying logic.

However, I do imagine that Bilbo had way more midichlorians than other hobbits, largely due to his Took side, which had the highest midichlorian count of all hobbit families.


Lusitano
Tol Eressea


Aug 7 2012, 1:24am

Post #110 of 112 (261 views)
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yes [In reply to] Can't Post

Not even Master Bombadil has a midichlorian count that high!


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Aug 7 2012, 2:56am

Post #111 of 112 (277 views)
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Love. lol [In reply to] Can't Post

I enjoyed reading that.

In Reply To
I really do despise this Lucasian need to explain away everything mysterious with some awfully unsatisfying logic.

However, I do imagine that Bilbo had way more midichlorians than other hobbits, largely due to his Took side, which had the highest midichlorian count of all hobbit families.


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


redgiraffe
Rohan

Aug 13 2012, 11:16am

Post #112 of 112 (356 views)
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I feel like I'm the odd man out on this. [In reply to] Can't Post

I think the article was really well written and has great ideas for that main story that I think/hope will be the structure of the films (excluding Sauron showing up at BO5A). His breakdown of the three parts really got me excited.

But then.... once he got into the part about how " it is quite likely here that a whole other section could be added" he lost my excitement as he said quite a few things that have me worried if they turn out to be true.

1) The Climax of film 3 needs to be the end of the Battle of Five Armies. I think it would be a REALLY bad idea if this were the second act and then continue on with other stuff that occurs well after Bilbo's journey home.

2) I think Bilbo's direct return home should be the end of the resolution of the film. Yeah, I'm okay with having a lengthy resolution to wrap things up with characters and possibly have Bilbo BRIEFLY MENTION some events that have happened since his return home. But I don't want to see an entire third half of the movie about the hunt for Gollum and whatnot.

3) OH MY GOD PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE, PJ, do not go with this whole "Parallel" timeline to LOTR. PJ and even GDT said from the beginning that they wanted to hobbit to seamlessly transition into LOTR. The framing device with Holm really does that perfectly. PLEASE just have Bilbo narrating the story in hobbiton a short time before the party in FOTR. No Rivendell. No Post-ROTK narration. It flows so perfectly from one story to the next if he has bilbo narrating in hobbiton before the events of FOTR.

4) If PJ were going to film extra stuff like the battle of Dale, then why would he do it like that and put it in the hobbit when he could just easily go back and put it in a future extended version of ROTK?

Anyone else with me on this?

Other than that I LOVED the first part of his review. Everything would work out great as long as PJ ends it where the hobbit timeline ends and has the framing device set up the very beginning of FOTR.

-Sir are you classified as human
-Negative, I am a meat-popsicle

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