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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
From Variety: Unions to thesps:" Don't work on The Hobbit"
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Tim
Tol Eressea


Sep 28 2010, 1:19am

Post #151 of 330 (3087 views)
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I agree this is just what we've already read it's a re-hash. // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

King Arthur: Who are you who can summon fire without flint or tinder?
Tim: There are some who call me... Tim.


Pioneer
Rivendell


Sep 28 2010, 1:58am

Post #152 of 330 (3097 views)
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Cool with me. [In reply to] Can't Post

I was treated well & paid heaps for overtime in Narnia. Smile


Edit - just heard that there's some big meeting in Wellington tonight.


Nick Frost for Bombur

(This post was edited by Pioneer on Sep 28 2010, 2:04am)


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 2:51am

Post #153 of 330 (3033 views)
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Big scary stuff to panic the herd.// [In reply to] Can't Post

 

Kangi Ska

Make the Hobbit Happen Now!

Photobucket

(This post was edited by Kangi Ska on Sep 28 2010, 2:52am)


weaver
Half-elven

Sep 28 2010, 2:53am

Post #154 of 330 (3018 views)
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Yahoo news has put it on their homepage... [In reply to] Can't Post

I spotted this story on the yahoo home page, but it comes and goes as a featured story there..but since it's up now, I thought I'd link it here...

Yahoo story

On the home page, they used the shot of Frodo about to disappear in the Prancing Pony -- (hmm...maybe that explains what happens to the story?) Well, it was kind of nice to see him there -- on and off --even if the article was depressing!

Hope this link works, Altaira! Smile

Weaver




Lark
The Shire


Sep 28 2010, 2:57am

Post #155 of 330 (3006 views)
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Let me duck out by saying... [In reply to] Can't Post

I really do think this will all get sorted out, and it is just another bump in the road. I feel bad I may have come off short before, I just get worked up about stuff I care about!! I never post, I just felt like some people were only seeing from PJ's point of view, and I just wanted to shed a light on another perspective that's all.

Heart Lark


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 3:04am

Post #156 of 330 (2996 views)
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Fascinating [In reply to] Can't Post

Not an expert ha! That is one of the clearest explanations I've seen yet.Laugh

Just an additional observation on what you said here (and then I'm out):


Quote
It is ultimately up to the producer and contractor to negotiate the terms of the work contract and decide whether or not they are happy to work under the conditions of the contract. There is no industry standard contract for every production. Each production company creates new contracts when they offer the jobs to cast or crew


It seems to me that it would be far more efficient -- therefore clearing up some of the waste in the hypothetical 97% of production expense --to deal with talent and crew as two groups (pink and blue) rather than negotiating working conditions on a worker by worker basis.

This is not my idea, or even my preference in all situations, but the approach is one taken by our provincial Ministry of Education. The Ministry requires that teachers join their respective unions because it sees a cost and time savings in dealing with teachers as a group of employees rather than as individual contractors. The analogy isn't too far off because teachers, like people in the entertainment industry, are seasonal or assignment by assignment workers.

It has been a great pleasure hearing your perspective and gleaning more information about what the production is up against. Really that's what most of us are on about around here... and I'm sure most, if not all of us, want nothing but the best for the people who will eventually bring The Hobbit to screens around the World. We're rooting for you!

SDC



Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 3:06am

Post #157 of 330 (3055 views)
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Who wrote this fo Yahoo Movies? [In reply to] Can't Post

"It's also worth noting that the weakest scenes in the "Lord of the Rings" movies take place in the shire where the hobbits live; basing two whole movies on just hobbit-land would seem far from the financial slam-dunk that the previous three movies were."

KS shakes his head. What a load of bunk.Mad

Kangi Ska

Make the Hobbit Happen Now!

Photobucket


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 3:14am

Post #158 of 330 (2950 views)
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All this aside, that is one gorgeous shot of Cate Blanchett attached to the article. / [In reply to] Can't Post

Evil sigh


(This post was edited by SirDennisC on Sep 28 2010, 3:14am)


squire
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 3:18am

Post #159 of 330 (3020 views)
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"two whole movies based in just the hobbit-land"? [In reply to] Can't Post

"Bilbo, run down to the Gaffer's and have him hold this Arkenstone, then we're off to Buckland to slay the dragon. In the second film we'll meet Bard and the Elven-King at the Golden Perch and settle up over a tall one!"



squire online:
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Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
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SirDennisC
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 3:22am

Post #160 of 330 (2973 views)
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Not at all [In reply to] Can't Post

I found your posts here touching in their honesty and earnestness. I believe it will get sorted out as well. As others have observed, in a sense, that there is a row at all likely means the production is close to springing to life.

Take care...


Tim
Tol Eressea


Sep 28 2010, 3:27am

Post #161 of 330 (2946 views)
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I dearly wish I could comment on the article [In reply to] Can't Post

Because it would be fun to kick sand in this stooge's eyes. Wink

King Arthur: Who are you who can summon fire without flint or tinder?
Tim: There are some who call me... Tim.


Ethel Duath
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 3:39am

Post #162 of 330 (3010 views)
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My jaw is stuck open--somebody help!! [In reply to] Can't Post

Send this poor soul a map (maybe that new interactive one . . .).ShockedWink


Eowyn of Penns Woods
Valinor


Sep 28 2010, 7:12am

Post #163 of 330 (2889 views)
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Nah... [In reply to] Can't Post

I recommend a clue-by-four to the head. Repeat application as needed.

**********************************


Bound
Rohan

Sep 28 2010, 9:03am

Post #164 of 330 (3337 views)
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Offical response from the Studio [In reply to] Can't Post

It's gets worse..

New Line, Warner Bros. Pictures and Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer Pictures are concerned by the recent allegations of unfair treatment of actors in New Zealand and instructions from the performers' guilds to their membership to withhold services from the producers of "The Hobbit" in New Zealand. We are proud to have good relations with all of those performers' guilds and value their contribution to the motion pictures produced in their respective jurisdictions throughout the world. But we believe that in this case the allegations are baseless and unfair to Peter Jackson and his team in Wellington who have been tireless supporters of the New Zealand motion picture community.

To classify the production as "non-union" is inaccurate. The cast and crew are being engaged under collective bargaining agreements where applicable and we are mindful of the rights of those individuals pursuant to those agreements. And while we have previously worked with MEAA, an Australian union now seeking to represent actors in New Zealand, the fact remains that there cannot be any collective bargaining with MEAA on this New Zealand production, for to do so would expose the production to liability and sanctions under New Zealand law. This legal prohibition has been explained to MEAA. We are disappointed that MEAA has nonetheless continued to pursue this course of action.

Motion picture production requires the certainty that a production can reasonably proceed without disruption and it is our general policy to avoid filming in locations where there is potential for work force uncertainty or other forms of instability. As such, we are exploring all alternative options in order to protect our business interests.


Read more: Studios Respond to Unions About The Hobbit - ComingSoon.net http://www.comingsoon.net/...=70190#ixzz10oTPnkle


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Sep 28 2010, 9:14am

Post #165 of 330 (2872 views)
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I think they both know [In reply to] Can't Post

(as well as Andy Serkis) that they could expect the same(ish) contracts that they signed for LotR. It's their Unions that are saying this as part of their process. I think each of them have the ability to work whatever job they want. I think McKellen, especially, has a fierce bond with Jackson and this project... so I'd like to see them hold him back.

sample sample

I really need these new films to take me back to, and not re-introduce me to, that magical world.



TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes



merlwynd
Rivendell


Sep 28 2010, 9:40am

Post #166 of 330 (2854 views)
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wow!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

Who put the fire cracker in the bee hive! Things are a jumping now peeps! Hang on to your hats!

MERLWYND
Bard's case to Thorin


Silmaril
Rohan


Sep 28 2010, 9:46am

Post #167 of 330 (2939 views)
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puhhh... this is a serious conflict!! [In reply to] Can't Post

the whole situation seems to get worse and worse...just when i thought that everything falls in the right place. i cannot believe it.


Pipe Dream
Gondor


Sep 28 2010, 10:02am

Post #168 of 330 (2990 views)
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SAG's Global Rule One [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
Beginning on May 1, 2002, SAG expanded its protections globally to better serve the needs of members in this rapidly changing, global entertainment economy and to ensure that the protections of the Guild follow our performers wherever they may work.

Quote
What will happen to people who violate Global Rule One?
Screen Actors Guild’s purpose in enforcing Global Rule One is to educate members that a union contract is mandatory if SAG is to be able to continue to fully protect them into the future. Members who violate Rule One could be required to appear before a Trial Board conducted by a group of their peers. A Trial Board has the authority to Discipline to impose fines, suspend, or expel a member from the union.




I was curious about what would happen to SAG actors if they went to NZ to work anyway and found this on their web site. Who's going to risk violating that? This isn't going to go away any time soon and I'm sure all of the other guilds/unions are going to have similar consequences.

Photobucket

Pre-Pre-production goes ever on and on...

(This post was edited by Pipe Dream on Sep 28 2010, 10:10am)


sphdle1
Gondor


Sep 28 2010, 11:39am

Post #169 of 330 (2867 views)
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Not looking good ... Jackson can't be happy right now... [In reply to] Can't Post

It looks like the Hobbit 'may' possibly be filmed in Europe based on that statement.

MEAA are doing this for the wrong reasons and the wrong timing (just prior to a green light to pull this stunt), using The Hobbit and putting actors jobs in NZ in jeopardy, as well as, at the expense of the fans and everyone who wants to see this movie made or is involved in the making of it. Jackson has had enough delays...this just puts it over the edge.

Maybe unions have their place to protect workers, but this is not protecting workers...they have a different, seemly more power hungry hidden agenda, and are exploiting The Hobbit to do so.

I hope MGM, production companies, and lawyers can quickly address this, and that MEAA will back down.


Tim
Tol Eressea


Sep 28 2010, 1:04pm

Post #170 of 330 (2906 views)
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I don't see them expelling [In reply to] Can't Post

Ian McKellan, Cate Blanchett, or any other big name - celebrities operate under a different sphere of reality sometimes.

King Arthur: Who are you who can summon fire without flint or tinder?
Tim: There are some who call me... Tim.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 2:33pm

Post #171 of 330 (2822 views)
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Studios answer ti big scary stuff. [In reply to] Can't Post

As I said earlier...a bunch of international labor lawyers are going to make a lot of money.

Kangi Ska

Make the Hobbit Happen Now!

Photobucket


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Sep 28 2010, 3:07pm

Post #172 of 330 (2862 views)
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Will Leitch: Author of the Bunk [In reply to] Can't Post

A quick google scan puts him in several places includung Twitter (Sorry I do not tweet twits) I would like to point out his ignorance to him and to Yahoo (I do business with them).

Kangi Ska

Make the Hobbit Happen Now!

Photobucket


Tim
Tol Eressea


Sep 28 2010, 3:25pm

Post #173 of 330 (2791 views)
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Yup. The Studios and PJ are sympatico [In reply to] Can't Post

Both are saying it's illegal to bargain with the union and that they'll go to Europe to film if they have to.

And they will folks. This film will make too much money not to be made - so if they have to make it somewhere else they will.

So who's really going to get hurt here? The New Zealand little guy.

Australia you should have resolved this years ago with the New Zealand government.


King Arthur: Who are you who can summon fire without flint or tinder?
Tim: There are some who call me... Tim.


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Sep 28 2010, 3:30pm

Post #174 of 330 (2879 views)
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That's irrelevant in this case [In reply to] Can't Post

Read again carefully what they say about Global Rule One:


Quote
In plain language, that means that a SAG member must always work under a union contract, and must NEVER work non-union.


No one is suggesting the union actors work on The Hobbit non-union. The issue surrounds the desire of the FIA and MEAA to negotiate collectively for the non-union NZ actors. They're not urging union actors to not work union on the Hobbit. They're urging them to not work on the Hobbit at all in support of the non-union actors.

In LOTR, the union actors worked under contracts that conformed to union conditions and the non-union actors worked under individual agreements. Based on PJs statements, and industry practice as we've heard from NZ actors here and read from other sources, it would be the same for The Hobbit.


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase



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Elladan
Rivendell

Sep 28 2010, 3:32pm

Post #175 of 330 (2784 views)
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Hmm computer error I guess [In reply to] Can't Post

It would appear my response wasnt posted.

I was simply observing that a model maker would be under the employ of Weta workshop and so would be assigned to what ever film was required rather than employed specifically for any given project. As opposed to an actor who would be hired for the duration of a given project. As such it is easy to see a difference between the 2 cases.

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