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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Is anyone else worried about the fact that "The Hobbit" is going to be turned into two movies?
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Jun 26 2009, 4:09pm

Post #76 of 81 (936 views)
I prefer that revised edition... [In reply to] Can't Post

I prefer that revised edition because otherwise it feels, in retrospect, like a very obvious foreshadowing that the Ring is having an affect on his character. Bilbo just doesn't seem like he should be spiteful.

Thine own will, be thine own fate...

farmer maggot

Jun 26 2009, 11:16pm

Post #77 of 81 (929 views)
Hi Dormouse, I will post that thread [In reply to] Can't Post

and will let you know when I do and where to look. Thanks for your thoughts and comments which do start to give more insight into the background to the writing process but actually still beg more questions for me.

In my swift initial reading of the comparisons the comment about finding the ring as a turning point in Bilbo's career seemed to me to refer to his reluctant career as a burglar, with the invisibility confered by the ring allowing him to be sucessful against all odds. That would make it a fairly natural comment but it could easily have a wider and deeper meaning.

What really now intrigues me is how easily JRRT could use fairly minor re-writes to the Hobbit a little later to fully link the Hobbit and LOTR stories within one Third Age history and one consistent mythological geography. I had expected some revisions to be laced all through the book to achieve consistency and that precious sense of a real and open ended historical narrative. So much of The Hobbit seems almost perfectly pre-set. Was the whole plan, if not the details, of Third Age history already in Tolkien's head and this children's story a way of testing the water before committing to writing the complete story?

Perhaps the reasearch and Tolkien scholars can throw some light on this. We know the re-writes do somewhat change the sense of Bilbo's character (for me anyway) but they also open the door to glimpses of much more profound forces working underneath both these stories, with the ring as just the tip of the iceberg.

I will post the thread as soon as I have time.


Jul 15 2009, 8:24pm

Post #78 of 81 (929 views)
Where the movies split... [In reply to] Can't Post

I think this is what will determine whether or not the overall reception of the movies is a good one. If the first movie ends and the viewer is left feeling like /nothing/ is accomplished then general audience members who haven't read the book will probably not be encouraged to return for the sequel.

That being said - I have to skim the book again to verify this hypothesis - I think they will end the first movie after Sauron is forced out of Mirkwood in his Necromancer form. That would be an uphill swing into the next movie, and the audience would feel pretty entertained even though Smaug hasn't been seen yet.

This has probably been speculated before... Any thoughts?


Jul 15 2009, 8:36pm

Post #79 of 81 (886 views)
Maybe... [In reply to] Can't Post

Well, on the one hand that's a good idea thematically and tonally, but if we're looking at "The Hobbit" as a separate entity from "The Lord of the Rings" films then we don't really want to know in advance that Saruman is the evil Necromancer because then it spoils the revelation that Saruman has been corrupted in "The Fellowship of the Ring". The same could also be said that we don't really want any discussion of Sauron or The One Ring in "The Hobbit" because that would too accurately foreshadow the events of "LotR" and ultimately minimalize the emotional impact of those films. This is where I have a huge problem with taking the material from the appendices and including them in the book. Tolkien never intended for that material to find its way into the story's narrative, hence their exclusion from the main thread of the story and their inclusion in the appendices.

My main concern is that rather than treating "The Hobbit" as its own unique story, the filmmakers will turn it into a prequel, which it isn't really at all. For an example, what the filmmakers need to think about is how "The Hobbit" will introduce new fans to "The Lord of the Rings" who haven't seen those films first. Take for example "Star Wars". For that unfortunate generation that saw the prequels first and then the original films, they'll already know that Luke and Leia are brother and sister and that they're Darth Vader's children and the classic revelations in the original films go from being of shocking emotional power to redundant instead. That's why prequels are so tricky to pull off. You have to be able to introduce enough new story material to keep viewers interested while staying true to the pre-established story. Not an easy feat by any means.

Thine own will, be thine own fate...


Jul 15 2009, 9:15pm

Post #80 of 81 (891 views)
Suruman = Necromancer? [In reply to] Can't Post

Forgive me but I thought the Necromancer in The Hobbit was SAURON not SARUMAN. If Saruman was the Necromancer that was removed from the stronghold in Mirkwood, then Gandalf would NEVER have gone to him for counsel in The Fellowship of the Ring. Saruman may show hints at his corruption if the filmmakers decide to show us the Council that Gandalf attends during his absence, but aside from that, SAURON is the "evil" that is removed from Mirkwood, not SARUMAN...

I'm pretty sure I'm right or else I've been reading these books all wrong for the last decade! Can anyone confirm?


Jul 15 2009, 9:18pm

Post #81 of 81 (988 views)
Oops [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, you're right. I'm sorry for that bit of confusion. I'm writing three things at once while I'm posting here as well, so I wasn't thinking clearly. But you get the idea of my general concerns about foreshadowing, don't you?

Thine own will, be thine own fate...

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