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Earl
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jan 8 2009, 7:58am


Views: 14003
Thoughts

Okay, I'm wondering where to begin. Let me start by saying that I agree with your assessment of Gandalf's character being a kind of grandfather-figure within the mythology. And as you said, he was an angelic being, a Maia, before he came to Middle-earth, and was then clothed in flesh, according to his "male temperament".

Alright. Now here's my answer laid out in three parts.

Firstly, wizards and celibacy in general. In the chapter on The Istari in Unfinished Tales, Tolkien says that the wizards were "subject to the fears and pains and weariness of earth, able to hunger and thirst and be slain; though because of their noble spirits they did not die, and aged only by the cares and labours of many long years". Now you could take this literally and say that Tolkien did not mention that they were subject to the "desires and/or lusts" of mortal men, and that would solve the issue in a snap. However, in reading that sentence broadly, you realize that the above words speak to their limitations as men in the flesh. Additionally, the text also says that "they were forbidden to match his [Sauron's] power with power, or to seek to dominate Elves and Men by force or fear". Which is to say that the only restrictions placed on them were to not reveal themselves in power. So taking the two sentences together, you realize that Tolkien only really talks about the wizards insofar as their purpose on Middle-earth was concerned. There were no other bonds laid upon them, and they were given free will to work as they deemed fit toward that higher cause for which they were sent. They weren't even bound to oppose Sauron, and they were given free will in that matter as well. But of course, they were well aware of the consequences of choosing one path over the other. And so the wizards were surely not bound to celibacy; and just as Saruman lusted for power, and Radagast fell in love with birds and beasts, there could well be the possibility that wizards could lust after the pleasures of the flesh.

Having established this, I'll move on to Gandalf (as an Istar). Sir Ian McKellen's comments aside, I personally believe that the notion of desiring sex, whether with man or woman, was not part of Gandalf's personality. Gandalf, of all the wizards, stayed true to his purpose. Now that does not necessarily mean that he did not experience the occasional carnal pleasure, nor does it mean that having sex would be a distraction from him continuing to work towards his true purpose. But I think that since Gandalf loved all good things and all good people, being sooner moved to pity than to anger, he was a "people person": one who easily befriended people who worked towards the general good. But there's one more reason I believe Gandalf (as an Istar) did not indulge in sex, and maybe what's influencing me is my firm disbelief in casual sex. I'm thinking along the lines of a "long-term relationship". Assuming that Gandalf thought like me, would he really and truly believe that making a long-term commitment with someone on Middle-earth would work out? If he did have someone in mind, whether a man or a woman, the eventuality would be disastrous, a consequence much worse that the fate of Aragorn and Arwen. Arwen, in choosing to give herself to Aragorn, became a mortal. Even though her parting with Aragorn was painful, at least she could die after that and not live forever in loneliness. But would the same hold true for an Istar? Could an Istar choose mortality? I'd think not. They were "able to hunger and thirst and be slain; though because of their noble spirits they did not die, and aged only by the cares and labours of many long years" [The Istari: Unfinished tales]. So I'd think Gandalf would never begin a relationship that would end in this way. His fate would be like that of Elrond, who had to live forever with the knowledge that somewhere on Middle-earth the body of his daughter lay dead. Similarly, Gandalf would go into the West, leaving his love upon Middle-earth (whether a man or a woman is irrelevant), and would have to spend the rest of his days (meaning, forever) wondering what fate had he/she come to.

So having established that Gandalf the Istar would not have had sex, I'll move on last to Gandalf the Maia i.e., Olorin. And as far as my knowledge of Tolkien (and my knowledge of deduction) goes, I'd say that Olorin was a Maia, a noble spirit, and I refuse to believe that such beings would go about having promiscuous sex. In fact, I don't really think that Maiar and Valar had sex even with their "spouses" to begin with. Sex is a method of reproductoin. That it is also pleasureable (and hence abused) is secondary. Therefore I'd say that Maiar and Valar, having no use for reproduction (since as far as we know, there weren't ever baby Maiar and Valar running about Valinor) would not have an understanding and a desire for sex, in a way that Elves, Men and Dwarves did.

And so my conclusion (with the sum of all my personal opinions Blush) is that Gandalf was asexual.


Crows and Gibbets! What is The House Of Eorl but a thatched barn where brigands drink in the reek, and their brats roll around on the floor with their dogs! You are but a lesser son of greater Sires.

(This post was edited by Earl on Jan 8 2009, 7:59am)


Edit Log:
Post edited by Earl (Forum Admin) on Jan 8 2009, 7:59am


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