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Expand entire thread Sticky: **Two Towers read-through - schedule and volunteers needed: could you (yes, YOU :) ) lead a chapter? noWizardme 478 17 Sun, 10:39pm Jump to last post in thread (by jochenkeen)

  Expand entire thread Sticky: General notice re book discussions and the use of copyrighted materials Ataahua 43224 1 Jun 20 2007, 12:34pm Jump to last post in thread (by Wynnie)

  Sticky: Thread Locked Welcome to the Reading Room (-->Including links to old RR discussions!) Altaira 40724 0 Dec 28 2006, 3:11am Jump to last post in thread (by Altaira)

Sticky: How Best to Contact an Admin for Help Kyriel 35642 0 Mar 31 2009, 10:44pm Jump to last post in thread (by Kyriel)

  Expand entire thread Silmarilion Discussion: Chapter 16 -- "Of Maeglin" Maciliel 13374 380 Jun 16 2013, 10:27am Jump to last post in thread (by noWizardme)

  Expand entire thread Silmarillion Discussion, Chapter 19: Of Beren and Luthien: Love, etc. CuriousG 20778 343 Jul 8 2013, 8:00pm Jump to last post in thread (by Brethil)

  Expand entire thread The Fellowship of the Ring Discussion, Chapter Two: The Shadow of the Past Kim 13758 226 Dec 22 2014, 1:11am Jump to last post in thread (by Brethil)

  Expand entire thread 'The Fellowship of the Ring' Discussion, Chapter One: A Long-Expected Party Rembrethil 24790 186 Dec 17 2014, 2:33pm Jump to last post in thread (by Rembrethil)

  Expand entire thread The Numenorean Kingdoms, part XI - bridge-film material? sador 23080 182 Feb 8 2009, 9:47pm Jump to last post in thread (by simplyaven)

  Expand entire thread Reading Room Culture Dreamdeer 24493 177 Mar 19 2009, 9:38pm Jump to last post in thread (by Idril Celebrindal)

  Expand entire thread The Tale of Years (Appendix B): Part I ľ The 2nd Age, 1 -1600 Morthoron 6734 160 Mar 15 2009, 9:15pm Jump to last post in thread (by Eowyn of Penns Woods)

  Expand entire thread need help filling in some blanks please (First Age, Elros, Elrond, Gil-galad, etc.) erynion 11882 159 Jun 9 2013, 9:36am Jump to last post in thread (by wildespace)

  Collapse Do Elves have free will? visualweasel 2960 156 Aug 21 2008, 3:53pm Jump to last post in thread (by visualweasel)
       Collapse Could you provide some ground rules? FarFromHome 2404 3 Aug 21 2008, 5:18pm
           Collapse Yes, good questions! visualweasel 2419 2 Aug 21 2008, 5:52pm
               Collapse I say "Tolkien and Free Will" is very popular this year a.s. 2316 1 Aug 22 2008, 11:16am
                   Those sound interesting, but no. visualweasel 2297 0 Aug 22 2008, 2:55pm
       Collapse Mandos and Aule Dreamdeer 2372 7 Aug 21 2008, 9:53pm
           Collapse Yes, yes, I agree. visualweasel 2365 6 Aug 21 2008, 10:05pm
               Collapse Yes. Elizabeth 2311 1 Aug 22 2008, 4:16am
                   Indeed. FarFromHome 2315 0 Aug 22 2008, 12:26pm
               Collapse why does "fairness" enter the argument? a.s. 2113 3 Aug 23 2008, 12:25pm
                   The "fairness" relates to moral responsibility FarFromHome 2051 0 Aug 23 2008, 3:44pm
                   Collapse Hell Dreamdeer 2135 1 Aug 23 2008, 4:36pm
                       "allowed for the possibility of Hell", then a.s. 2052 0 Aug 23 2008, 6:19pm
       No. But I will have to get to this later. a.s. 2381 0 Aug 21 2008, 10:18pm
       Collapse Would anyone have thought to ask this question before 1977? N.E. Brigand 2367 3 Aug 21 2008, 11:05pm
           Collapse Good point! visualweasel 2361 2 Aug 22 2008, 2:06pm
               Gimli Dreamdeer 2307 0 Aug 22 2008, 4:59pm
               free will implies the ability to sin a.s. 2088 0 Aug 23 2008, 12:45pm
       Collapse I have long argued ... VoronwŰ_the_Faithful 2417 4 Aug 21 2008, 11:54pm
           Collapse The Great Tolkienic Contradiction Conspiracy... Morthoron 2513 1 Aug 22 2008, 1:12am
               Fickle Finger of Fate Dreamdeer 2310 0 Aug 22 2008, 2:46am
           yes, and the answer is more complex, too a.s. 2281 0 Aug 22 2008, 10:57am
           I simply can't help myself ... visualweasel 2429 0 Aug 22 2008, 2:09pm
       Collapse There is no answer, of course Beren IV 2342 12 Aug 22 2008, 1:58am
           Collapse Be careful... Aelfwine 2349 4 Aug 22 2008, 2:42am
               Yes, this is one of the most central issues visualweasel 2258 0 Aug 22 2008, 2:51pm
               Collapse Peter Kreeft, in his book The Philosophy of Tolkien ElanorTX 2075 1 Aug 23 2008, 4:25am
                   Machine stories Aelfwine 2063 0 Aug 23 2008, 2:02pm
               *if* there is free will for any created being, then a.s. 2066 0 Aug 23 2008, 12:36pm
           Collapse The Big But... Morthoron 2296 4 Aug 22 2008, 2:48am
               Collapse So what does 'fading' mean? Beren IV 2292 3 Aug 22 2008, 7:25am
                   Collapse Fading and will? Dreamdeer 2299 2 Aug 22 2008, 4:46pm
                       Collapse Limited free will Beren IV 2083 1 Aug 23 2008, 1:59am
                           What you would have done Elizabeth 2058 0 Aug 23 2008, 4:33am
           Collapse Not so, actually: Aelfwine 2389 1 Aug 22 2008, 2:55am
               Have You Seen It? VoronwŰ_the_Faithful 2311 0 Aug 22 2008, 6:35am
       Collapse Was Flieger's Basic Thesis Different Than What She Previously Has Said? VoronwŰ_the_Faithful 2306 33 Aug 22 2008, 2:06pm
           Collapse I don't think so; however a.s. 2121 32 Aug 22 2008, 9:44pm
               Collapse Did you believe it before reading "The Silmarillion"? N.E. Brigand 2138 31 Aug 22 2008, 9:56pm
                   I never even thought about it prior to that a.s. 2162 0 Aug 22 2008, 10:15pm
                   Collapse Why Does It Matter VoronwŰ_the_Faithful 2093 29 Aug 22 2008, 10:47pm
                       Collapse "There isn't time to dig trenches. We'll have to buy them ready made." N.E. Brigand 2100 28 Aug 22 2008, 11:43pm
                           Collapse Apart from Il˙vitar's underlying plan... Beren IV 2110 2 Aug 23 2008, 2:14am
                               Collapse Predictions are not requirements. Elizabeth 2061 1 Aug 23 2008, 5:03am
                                   Turin's Curse Dreamdeer 2026 0 Aug 23 2008, 4:15pm
                           Collapse The works in question were in existence when LOTR was published VoronwŰ_the_Faithful 2105 24 Aug 23 2008, 2:59am
                               By 1952, Tolkien knew that "The Silmarillion" wouldn't be published. N.E. Brigand 2079 0 Aug 23 2008, 5:18am
                               Collapse We're arguing over "canon" Beren IV 2039 22 Aug 23 2008, 7:06pm
                                   Collapse Alrighty then... Morthoron 2100 11 Aug 23 2008, 10:47pm
                                       Collapse Post-script... Morthoron 2024 1 Aug 23 2008, 11:05pm
                                           Beren N.E. Brigand 2019 0 Aug 23 2008, 11:08pm
                                       Collapse No canon. N.E. Brigand 2034 5 Aug 23 2008, 11:12pm
                                           Collapse Hmmm... Morthoron 2043 4 Aug 23 2008, 11:43pm
                                               Collapse I agree with your premise... Dreamdeer 2069 2 Aug 24 2008, 1:33am
                                                   Collapse Aragorn said that!?!?! Samamir 2025 1 Aug 24 2008, 1:43am
                                                       Cut for a reason? Dreamdeer 2042 0 Aug 24 2008, 1:47am
                                               To whom are you responding? N.E. Brigand 1972 0 Aug 24 2008, 7:00am
                                       Collapse "Not canonical" does not mean apocryphal. Beren IV 2042 1 Aug 24 2008, 12:53am
                                           I disagree... Morthoron 2008 0 Aug 24 2008, 1:47am
                                       And even LotR was fluid. Dreamdeer 2022 0 Aug 24 2008, 1:28am
                                   FWIW, _I'm_ not arguing over canon Aelfwine 2009 0 Aug 24 2008, 2:04am
                                   Collapse I'm confused. What is "canon" and what is it good for? squire 2027 8 Aug 24 2008, 3:11am
                                       Not only that... FarFromHome 1981 0 Aug 24 2008, 7:32am
                                       Collapse Except that this question Beren IV 1983 6 Aug 24 2008, 8:24am
                                           Collapse Fade to Black (or Dark Elves)... Morthoron 2061 4 Aug 24 2008, 9:10am
                                               Ah. N.E. Brigand 1956 0 Aug 24 2008, 4:22pm
                                               Collapse FŰanor's destiny Beren IV 1965 2 Aug 24 2008, 6:45pm
                                                   Collapse Well... Morthoron 2075 1 Aug 24 2008, 7:31pm
                                                       I have to agree in general Beren IV 2018 0 Aug 24 2008, 8:45pm
                                           I suppose you are right. squire 1974 0 Aug 24 2008, 1:55pm
       Collapse free will and other runimations a.s. 2106 4 Aug 23 2008, 11:36am
           Collapse Constrained by the Music Aelfwine 2384 3 Aug 23 2008, 1:46pm
               Collapse *if* free will, by definition, a.s. 2215 2 Aug 23 2008, 2:38pm
                   Collapse Are you defining "free will" FarFromHome 2031 1 Aug 23 2008, 4:16pm
                       yes, and no a.s. 2039 0 Aug 23 2008, 6:37pm
       Collapse Why does it matter? // N.E. Brigand 2016 21 Aug 23 2008, 11:14pm
           Collapse To the Elves? Or to us? a.s. 1991 20 Aug 24 2008, 3:48am
               Collapse What rhymes with Hostetter? N.E. Brigand 2056 19 Aug 24 2008, 9:54pm
                   Hmmm...Hostetter? Morthoron 2021 0 Aug 24 2008, 11:19pm
                   Collapse LOL! Aelfwine 2037 10 Aug 24 2008, 11:42pm
                       Collapse Ode dear! Morthoron 2075 9 Aug 25 2008, 4:15am
                           LOL!!! Aelfwine 2034 0 Aug 25 2008, 4:20am
                           Brilliant!! // a.s. 1976 0 Aug 25 2008, 11:15am
                           Now that impressed me! // Dreamdeer 1973 0 Aug 25 2008, 1:38pm
                           A triumphal note in an otherwise endless (but still fun) debate! visualweasel 2010 0 Aug 25 2008, 3:03pm
                           Come on, now you're just being silly, Beren IV 1979 0 Aug 25 2008, 4:45pm
                           Collapse How did I end up in the Reading Room? Magpie 1986 2 Aug 26 2008, 1:20am
                               Collapse The Dark Elf bows... Morthoron 1954 1 Aug 26 2008, 1:57am
                                   *applauds* Peredhil lover 1937 0 Aug 26 2008, 5:50am
                           *applause* Well done! // dernwyn 1953 0 Aug 26 2008, 2:23am
                   Collapse picks up the gauntlet a.s. 2136 6 Aug 25 2008, 12:47am
                       Collapse LOL! (nt) Aelfwine 2018 5 Aug 25 2008, 1:32am
                           Collapse ack!!! Only I would mis-spell a word in a post about linguistics! Help, admins a.s. 2032 4 Aug 25 2008, 1:42am
                               Collapse Ah, magic! dernwyn 1944 3 Aug 26 2008, 2:21am
                                   Collapse no, NEB has not posted his winning entry a.s. 1944 2 Aug 26 2008, 10:59am
                                       Collapse It's not N.E. Brigand 2021 1 Aug 27 2008, 9:30pm
                                           oh stop! It won because it was funny, it was topical a.s. 1988 0 Aug 27 2008, 10:09pm
       Collapse Do Men? Darkstone 1949 55 Aug 26 2008, 2:02pm
           Collapse Wyrd and Fate visualweasel 1956 51 Aug 26 2008, 2:19pm
               Collapse But... Darkstone 1929 50 Aug 26 2008, 3:26pm
                   Collapse No buts ... visualweasel 1949 49 Aug 26 2008, 3:29pm
                       Collapse Yes but a.s. 2017 27 Aug 26 2008, 10:21pm
                           Collapse It would be, but ... visualweasel 2001 26 Aug 26 2008, 10:24pm
                               Collapse I did not say "in Tolkien's legendarium" a.s. 2022 23 Aug 26 2008, 10:42pm
                                   Collapse Well, if you're going to bring the Primary World into this ... :) visualweasel 1998 22 Aug 27 2008, 12:10am
                                       Collapse I officially wash my hands of this discussion. Beren IV 1987 3 Aug 27 2008, 12:48am
                                           Collapse I wouldn't say that. N.E. Brigand 1980 1 Aug 27 2008, 3:21am
                                               Good point! visualweasel 1962 0 Aug 27 2008, 1:45pm
                                           On the contrary! Dreamdeer 1960 0 Aug 27 2008, 4:16pm
                                       Collapse I am going to try this one more time a.s. 2065 17 Aug 27 2008, 11:36am
                                           Getting frustrated? I'm sorry about that ... visualweasel 1981 0 Aug 27 2008, 2:00pm
                                           Collapse This is a sticking point for me... FarFromHome 1976 4 Aug 27 2008, 2:07pm
                                               Collapse Regarding Catholic Teaching... Dreamdeer 1966 2 Aug 27 2008, 4:23pm
                                                   Collapse Maybe but... FarFromHome 1958 1 Aug 27 2008, 5:01pm
                                                       I'm not trying to, I'm just trying to define "free will" a.s. 1953 0 Aug 27 2008, 6:30pm
                                               That was what I thought was meant by... a.s. 1945 0 Aug 27 2008, 5:57pm
                                           Collapse The way in which the Elves arguably do not have free will, then, Beren IV 1941 4 Aug 27 2008, 6:22pm
                                               Collapse if Elves do not, in fact, exist after Arda ceases to exist then, yes, they do not have free will by my definition of free will. a.s. 1958 3 Aug 27 2008, 6:40pm
                                                   Ah, but what about the Outer Darkness? Dreamdeer 2197 0 Aug 27 2008, 7:44pm
                                                   Yes, but there is always a Tolkienic contradiction... Morthoron 2016 0 Aug 27 2008, 9:35pm
                                                   My understanding was Beren IV 2072 0 Aug 28 2008, 2:41am
                                           Collapse That's quite helpful. N.E. Brigand 2031 5 Aug 27 2008, 6:48pm
                                               Collapse I don't think that's an accurate definition of Free Will from the Church's perspective. Aelfwine 2161 4 Aug 27 2008, 9:37pm
                                                   Collapse OK, I can accept that a.s. 1992 3 Aug 27 2008, 9:50pm
                                                       Collapse But, what we really need to decide once and for all... Morthoron 1992 2 Aug 27 2008, 10:27pm
                                                           Collapse And are they *free* to use them? ;) // visualweasel 1994 1 Aug 27 2008, 10:28pm
                                                               Or better, do they have the free will to use them? Morthoron 1985 0 Aug 27 2008, 10:29pm
                               Collapse Men, Elves and the Music VoronwŰ_the_Faithful 2012 1 Aug 26 2008, 11:03pm
                                   That is exactly what I have been saying a.s. 2019 0 Aug 27 2008, 10:55am
                       Collapse Yes buts. Elves have free will. Darkstone 1993 20 Aug 27 2008, 6:02pm
                           Collapse Although Galadriel's fall Beren IV 1974 5 Aug 27 2008, 6:17pm
                               Collapse The most sinful Elves Darkstone 1965 4 Aug 27 2008, 6:33pm
                                   Collapse So what did the three 'C's look like? Beren IV 2026 3 Aug 27 2008, 6:42pm
                                       Probably still pretty fair. Darkstone 2032 0 Aug 27 2008, 6:58pm
                                       Collapse Yes and No Dreamdeer 2072 1 Aug 27 2008, 8:15pm
                                           What a lovely image visualweasel 2017 0 Aug 27 2008, 9:15pm
                           Well said, and I agree. // visualweasel 1952 0 Aug 27 2008, 6:24pm
                           Collapse if they cannot go to Hell, they do not have free will a.s. 2024 12 Aug 27 2008, 6:54pm
                               Collapse So do The Elect have free will? Darkstone 2149 3 Aug 27 2008, 7:33pm
                                   Collapse I don't know. I think so, but a.s. 2149 2 Aug 27 2008, 11:23pm
                                       Collapse Please don't be so hard on yourself, "a.s."! Aelfwine 1992 1 Aug 28 2008, 12:00am
                                           You are a nice guy, aelf :-) a.s. 1976 0 Aug 28 2008, 12:18am
                               Collapse I disagree fundamentally, but we can still be friends :) visualweasel 2032 1 Aug 27 2008, 9:27pm
                                   it would depend upon how you define free will a.s. 1976 0 Aug 27 2008, 10:42pm
                               Collapse Angels in the apocrypha Beren IV 1958 5 Aug 28 2008, 2:45am
                                   Collapse The Dark Elf recalls his Catholic education... Morthoron 1971 4 Aug 28 2008, 3:51am
                                       Collapse Er... Aelfwine 2106 3 Aug 28 2008, 12:37pm
                                           Collapse To elucidate... Morthoron 2000 2 Aug 28 2008, 4:09pm
                                               Collapse You were quite clear. Aelfwine 2103 1 Aug 28 2008, 6:59pm
                                                   Let's agree to disagree then... Morthoron 1956 0 Aug 28 2008, 9:54pm
           Collapse Aragorn did have free will. Dreamdeer 1977 2 Aug 26 2008, 3:26pm
               Collapse And THAT is the point I've been trying to make! Beren IV 2024 1 Aug 26 2008, 7:38pm
                   Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more... Morthoron 2211 0 Aug 26 2008, 10:06pm
       Collapse It depends on your perspective. Curious 1698 3 Mar 22 2009, 5:17pm
           Collapse If I understand you, then I disagree :) visualweasel 1707 2 Mar 23 2009, 2:00pm
               Collapse I misspoke. Curious 1700 1 Mar 23 2009, 3:15pm
                   Agreed! :) // visualweasel 1903 0 Mar 23 2009, 3:18pm

  Expand entire thread **Unfinished Tales Discussion - Disaster of the Gladden Fields noWizardme 16380 154 Mar 6 2014, 8:28am Jump to last post in thread (by Plurmo)

  Expand entire thread It's Tolkien Reading Day! Post your ABCs of Tolkien here. N.E. Brigand 57651 148 Apr 4 2010, 7:52pm Jump to last post in thread (by Compa_Mighty)

  Expand entire thread Volunteers for next few Silmarillion chapters? CuriousG 2601 141 Apr 18 2013, 10:52am Jump to last post in thread (by Maciliel)

  Expand entire thread **CoH Discussion** I. The Childhood of T˙rin: 1. Ancestry squire 9091 134 Jun 28 2007, 5:47am Jump to last post in thread (by Daughter of Nienna)

  Expand entire thread Silmarillion Chapter 13: Of the Return of the Noldor Brethil 10757 132 May 22 2013, 1:10pm Jump to last post in thread (by Brethil)

  Expand entire thread Some confusing (to me) issues about the Power(s) of the Ring and Isildur Brethil 11887 129 Apr 3 2013, 6:04pm Jump to last post in thread (by CuriousG)
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